As many of you know we have a great asset in "veryoldschool", or VOS for short. He's forgotten more about RF and connectivity than many of us will ever learn.
I'd like to start by thanking him for his immense service to this forum, and I'd like to start an official thread for the many questions you all have for him about connected home, whole home viewing, or anything DIRECTV related.
Please keep to topic and if you have a question, please read on to see if it's been answered.
Guess I should say hi to all and feel free to ask away. I've been answering [and will continue to] a lot of private messages. The idea here is to share the questions and answers as it may help others to have the same question, or something along the same lines.
DBSTalk has become a great place for information, and this is just another place to look for it.
Is there a minimum length of the coax between the PI29 and SWM16 when using a standalone connected to the power port of the SWM16? I thought I read somewhere about it needing to be at least 15 feet. My cable is only about 16 inches long and I was worried it might hurt something. Everything is working fine.
Is there a minimum length of the coax between the PI29 and SWM16 when using a standalone connected to the power port of the SWM16? I thought I read somewhere about it needing to be at least 15 feet. My cable is only about 16 inches long and I was worried it might hurt something. Everything is working fine.
Going into the power [only] port doesn't have a minimum distance.
The 15' comes from the SWM8, and when powered by the SWM output.
This can be "shortened", if you use a splitter between the PI and the SWM8, or if you power a SWM8 through the #3 legacy port.
"Generally" the DC block in the PIs can cause some problems with RF if there isn't enough coax between the two. The SWiM and the DECA in the receivers has shown to have problems if the PI is too close. Using longer coax lengths or having a splitter between the two, ends up with a better impedance match and solves this.
Is there a minimum length of the coax between the PI29 and SWM16 when using a standalone connected to the power port of the SWM16? I thought I read somewhere about it needing to be at least 15 feet. My cable is only about 16 inches long and I was worried it might hurt something. Everything is working fine.
Going into the power [only] port doesn't have a minimum distance.
The 15' comes from the SWM8, and when powered by the SWM output.
This can be "shortened", if you use a splitter between the PI and the SWM8, or if you power a SWM8 through the #3 legacy port.
"Generally" the DC block in the PIs can cause some problems with RF if there isn't enough coax between the two. The SWiM and the DECA in the receivers has shown to have problems if the PI is too close. Using longer coax lengths or having a splitter between the two, ends up with a better impedance match and solves this.
I'm glad someone asked this - never thought to make a change when I moved from the SWM8 to the SWM16.
VOS, applying this to my configuration (below), you're saying that I am safe to remove the 15' loop between the SWM16 and the PI and replace it with a shorter cable length?
(Ethernet CAT5 not displayed below. Follow the link in my signature to view the full setup.)
I'm glad someone asked this - never thought to make a change when I moved from the SWM8 to the SWM16.
VOS, applying this to my configuration (below), you're saying that I am safe to remove the 15' loop between the SWM16 and the PI and replace it with a shorter cable length?
If your drawing is correct: you need to move the coax from the PI [going to the receivers] to where the PI now connects to the SWiM-16. Then connect the PI to the middle connector [not currently used] on the SWiM-16. This way you can then remove the 15' loop.
"This way":
The other option is to move the PI to the output of the splitter, but it seems easier to simply use the PWR connector and never need "to think" about swapping coax and receivers around on the splitter.
If your drawing is correct: you need to move the coax from the PI [going to the receivers] to where the PI now connects to the SWiM-16. Then connect the PI to the middle connector [not currently used] on the SWiM-16. This way you can then remove the 15' loop.
This is the PI-28 model power supply, so it looks different from the Power Supply in your image, so when I swap cables per your suggestion, which port of the PI-28 do I connect to the center port on the SWM? Also, do I terminate the unused port on the PI-28?
This is the PI-28 model power supply, so it looks different from the Power Supply in your image, so when I swap cables per your suggestion, which port of the PI-28 do I connect to the center port on the SWM? Also, do I terminate the unused port on the PI-28?
For each 2-way split is costs about the same 5 dB as 50' of coax [at the high frequency end].
Maybe a break down of splitters would help:
As you can see a 4-way output has gone through two 2-ways, and a 8-way has gone through three.
Each time you go through one, it has ~ 5 dB of loss.
SWiM to receiver can only have 30 dB of loss, so the less splitter loss, the longer coax you can have.
For each 2-way split is costs about the same 5 dB as 50' of coax [at the high frequency end].
Maybe a break down of splitters would help:
As you can see a 4-way output has gone through two 2-ways, and a 8-way has gone through three.
Each time you go through one, it has ~ 5 dB of loss.
SWiM to receiver can only have 30 dB of loss, so the less splitter loss, the longer coax you can have.
The less loss total, the less rainfade you will have, "but" the rain can get heavy enough to end up with no signal too.
What I have learned from reading VOS's posts and his analysis of various issues is that the fewer times you split the signal the better. The loss across an 8 way is the same as about 150' of cable (3 2-way splits at 50' each), or 15db of loss, half of the total limit. Using a 4-way instead is like moving your receiver 50 feet closer to the SWM.
Personally, I'd only use an 8-way if it were unavoidable.
As customers are moving to the HR34 and a SWiM-16, more attention needs to be paid to the type of splitters being used.
Each of the SWiM-16 outputs have the same range as the other SWiMs. If you keep within the 30 dB range, you won't have 771 errors.
I don't like using larger splitters than needed, since they are an inefficient way of doing things. Unused ports need terminations, which are just wasting signal into a resistor, that otherwise would go the the receiver(s), while at the same time adding more loss.
This looks like it's becoming more important with the DECA networking and the SWiM-16s.
The DECA crossover in the SWiM-16 has loss, and the DECA signals also have to pass through the splitters on both sides of the SWiM-16 outputs.
If there is too much loss "end to end" the receivers with internal DECA will report system error 47 or 48, as the network bandwidth is reduced.
Going into the power [only] port doesn't have a minimum distance.
The 15' comes from the SWM8, and when powered by the SWM output.
This can be "shortened", if you use a splitter between the PI and the SWM8, or if you power a SWM8 through the #3 legacy port.
"Generally" the DC block in the PIs can cause some problems with RF if there isn't enough coax between the two. The SWiM and the DECA in the receivers has shown to have problems if the PI is too close. Using longer coax lengths or having a splitter between the two, ends up with a better impedance match and solves this.
The cable between the PI29 R1 and SWM1\PWR port of the SWM8 is less the a foot. Another 1 foot cable from the PI29 runs to a 4 way splitter.
I am not experiencing any issues should I be concerned?
The cable between the PI29 R1 and SWM1\PWR port of the SWM8 is less the a foot. Another 1 foot cable from the PI29 runs to a 4 way splitter.
I am not experiencing any issues should I be concerned?
I can't really say you should be concerned, since I know of some who've done the same thing.
The min distance came from DirecTV, and it would seem they found "some cases" where there were problems.
It does sound like you have a splitter very close, so swapping the location of the PI and the splitter, so it's SWM8 ->1' coax-> 4-way -> 1' coax -> PI [on the power passing port]-> receiver, wouldn't be hard to do.
It does sound like you have a splitter very close, so swapping the location of the PI and the splitter, so it's SWM8 ->1' coax-> 4-way -> 1' coax -> PI [on the power passing port]-> receiver, wouldn't be hard to do.
Hi VOS. I have one of my HR20 DVRs constantly rebooting since the install of the new software (0x57b). Before I attempt to call directv, do you have any advice on what to try? Thanks.
DirecTV has announced the HR34/RVU combo, and Dish has announced Hopper/Joey. The former uses DECA and the latter uses MoCA. What are the technical differences, and is one superior to the other?
Hi VOS. I have one of my HR20 DVRs constantly rebooting since the install of the new software (0x57b). Before I attempt to call directv, do you have any advice on what to try? Thanks.
So you've got to give me a tough one. lol
These haven't been made in over 4 years.
Some have had power supplies go bad.
The couple of things to try:
Pull the power cord for a good 10 min and see what [if anything] happens when it boots back up.
When it does boot at the "running receiver self test" screen press select to enter the diagnostic menu and run the guided test to see if there are any errors.
If none of this shows anything, "you might see" if forcing the old software does.
At the first "Hello screen" press 02468 and it should change to searching for new software, and during the day, find the old Blue GUI. If it does "fix" the rebooting, it may not last because the new GUI will be pushed to you again, so this DVR may need to be replaced.
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