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TiVo vs EchoStar: Echostar found to be in Contempt

Discussion in 'General DISH™ Discussion' started by Curtis52, Jun 2, 2009.

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  1. Jun 3, 2009 #101 of 2012
    CuriousMark

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    I doubt that will ever happen. The judge will more likely just freeze Dish's bank accounts until they come into compliance.
     
  2. Jun 3, 2009 #102 of 2012
    dgordo

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    Or just impose a huge fine for everyday that they don't comply.
     
  3. Jun 3, 2009 #103 of 2012
    dgordo

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    That is my understanding as well, thus the, wow. :eek2:
     
  4. Jun 3, 2009 #104 of 2012
    spear61

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    This is interesting

    If Dish loses on appeal and does not cut deal, they are going to have a bunch of boxes they are prohibited from selling or reselling to anyone, can't even export them. Could be a really big stack of doorstops.

    The bright side is Echostar was moaning that box sales to Dish were down this winter. They may wel have a surge in sales.
     
  5. Jun 3, 2009 #105 of 2012
    peak_reception

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    Or, at the very least, been honest and open with the courts about the existence, scope, and progress of the workaround they did attempt. Hiding it the first time around may well hurt them badly this time around. I don't think they will get a stay now from the same court (CAFC) they bamboozled before by basically lying about the dire catastrophe they were about to incur by shutting down DVRs that in reality they had no intention whatever of shutting down. It's called "Crying Wolf" and nobody likes shady tactics like that.
     
  6. Jun 3, 2009 #106 of 2012
    CuriousMark

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    I can't argue with you there.

    Let's hope a settlement comes soon.
     
  7. Jun 3, 2009 #107 of 2012
    phrelin

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    Northern...
    Dish has no reason to buy expensive new boxes from Echostar if it, Dish Network the separate company, can pay a license fee to TiVo.

    Again, if I were representing TiVo, I'd offer Dish Network a very, very reasonable license fee for using already-in-use-or-owned-by-Dish-Network boxes including the ViP series. And I would offer Dish Network, the company no longer a part of Echostar, an opportunity to use TiVo brand boxes in it's system. I would not offer Echostar, no longer in any position to argue about it's DVR customers because it only has one, a license to permit it to manufacture and sell DVR's.

    The mantra here: Dish Network is not Echostar. Echostar is not Dish Network.

    I have a contract with Dish Network, not Echostar. Echostar has a contract with Dish Network to sell boxes it is prohibited from selling.
     
  8. Jun 3, 2009 #108 of 2012
    JohnH

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    Duh!! The same majority shareholder might play in this, though!
     
  9. Jun 3, 2009 #109 of 2012
    kog

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    I am pretty sure this has been mentioned before but do we know how many of these specific DVRs are still in service? I know people are arguing that all Dish DVR's are infringing but these are the only ones that are specifically identified.
     
  10. Jun 3, 2009 #110 of 2012
    Herdfan

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    DISH seems to have really pi**ed off the judge. Who knows what he might do. But, yes freezing accounts would be easier.
     
  11. Jun 3, 2009 #111 of 2012
    uss growler

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    get a bailout from the government then Declair bakruptcy and sell whats left to direct tv.
     
  12. Jun 3, 2009 #112 of 2012
    phrelin

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    Yes, but Dish Network is not a privately held company and Charlie has legal problems. Dish Network shares sell on the open market. AS a corporate officer with fiduciary responsiblities, Charlie cannot lawfully risk Dish Network's survival to protect Echostar's interests unless he wants to buy out all the minority shareholders and take it private.

    In fact, if Dish were to receive a reasonable offer from TiVo (reasonable by a normal market standard), minority shareholders could sue if Dish were to turn it down and then proceed to shut off all the listed DVR's and buy DVR's from Echostar which are basically unlawful under Folsom's ruling until proven otherwise to Folsom's satisfaction.

    Charlie pissed off Folsom after already screwing TiVo. In any other situation except where he is major shareholder, the Board would be offering him a golden parachute as they fire him.
     
  13. Jun 3, 2009 #113 of 2012
    HobbyTalk

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    That will never happen for many years. TiVo does not manufacture any any hardware other then their add-on TiVo boxes. DirecTV is developing and will manufacture their STB with the TiVo software. It would take TiVo many years to develop a suitable and stable sat. receiver.
     
  14. Jun 3, 2009 #114 of 2012
    phrelin

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    True. But working with Dish Network, it might not be so hard to create an add-on box for existing receivers like the ViP211. But, of course, the ideal would be for Echostar/Dish Network simply to pay a license fee. No muss, no fuss for TiVo to make money. Everyone's a winner then.:D
     
  15. Jun 3, 2009 #115 of 2012
    ziggy29

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    Other than their renewed partnership with D*, I don't know that TiVo is looking to market their own STBs for satellite anyway. I would think that it would be TiVo's software with TiVo technology licensed to run on Dish's STBs -- assuming this legal morass eventually leads to a settlement and a licensing agreement.
     
  16. Jun 3, 2009 #116 of 2012
    bobukcat

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    I wonder why the "other" DVR manufacturers (E*, Motorola, Scientific Atlanta, etc) don't form a joint effort to develop a non-infringing DVR. You know that if something drastic doesn't change in this case Tivo is going to be going after them for $$ too.
     
  17. Jun 3, 2009 #117 of 2012
    scooper

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    That's the whole point of this exercise from Tivo's standpoint - to force EVERYONE else to pay them a license fee.

    You can bet that Motorola, Scientific Atlanta, etc will start to workup licensing arraingements after this.
     
  18. Jun 3, 2009 #118 of 2012
    ziggy29

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    Could easily be a violation of antitrust laws, seen as collusion to drive TiVo out of business.
     
  19. Jun 3, 2009 #119 of 2012
    scooper

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    I think that would be a good thing in this case...:D
     
  20. Jun 3, 2009 #120 of 2012
    phrelin

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    Northern...
    Not necessarily. There are those at TheStreet.com who note:
    In other words, Coyne thinks the Echostar case is because of a particularly egregious set of actions. Now the judge sees Echostar as engaging in further egregious activity by implementing it's "workaround" without telling him or the appeals court. Consider how clearly he spelled this out as a means of clearly describing Echostar as a defiant outlaw:
    In essence, Folsom pointed out to the appellate judges that Charlie gave them the finger just as he did to TiVo and Folsom. Now maybe the appellate judges won't see it that way, but they are going to have to begin their consideration of the appeal by considering that this guy, these companies, may in fact have no respect for the courts.:nono:
     
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