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Why do people prefer inferior LCDs to superior Plasmas or even CRTs?

Discussion in 'High Definition Displays' started by Jack White, Jun 10, 2009.

  1. Jun 10, 2009 #1 of 161
    Jack White

    Jack White Icon

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    For people who don't like to read, just watch this video.
    120hz Samsung LCD(on Left) vs Panasonic Plasma(on right).
    This video basically sums up most of what I've said in a video.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UMIPi9bx1GE

    I mean the best flat panel televisions out there currently are clearly all the Pioneer Kuro Elite Plasma Display Panels. The best LCDs with Local Dimming LED backlighting are still far behind the Kuro Elites. I know becuase I comapred all the televisions intensively before buying my Kuro Elite. The XBR8 is probably be best LCD ever made, yet it still falls far far short of even 8th generation Kuro Elites let alone the 9G Kuro Elites. The funny thing is that average customers and even some people who work at my store think that the Samsung LCDs with LED Edge Lighting are actually a COMPLETELY NEW FORM of TELEVISION like OLED or SED. Yes, most LCDs don't have a problem with reflections, they're far more immune from image retention and from burnin, but they still don't have the best picture quality which is by far the most important thing at least to me.
    The MAIN reason I think that LCDs are so sucessful is because of a a campaign about LIES about Plasmas. Image Retention and Burnin is not really 1/100th the problem that it's made out to be, and plasma gas leaking is really an urban legend created by LCD manufacturers.
    The other thing is that HORRIBLE HORRIBLE store lighting is probably the main culprit for people prefering LCDs over Plasmas. LCDs are brigher, but they're FAR FAR brighter than they need to be in a living room/family room/bedroom setting. LCDs are suited better for the GLARING LIGHTS of a consumer electronics store. If you go into the Magnolia Section though, the advantage of the Plasmas really shows. The Kuro Elites BLOW AWAY the XBR8s and the Top of the Line 950 series Samsung 950 in the Magnolia enviornment. Even the V Series Panasonic Plasmas outperform the best LCDs for far less money in the Magnolia Enviornment. The MAJOR design flaw with LCDs is HORRIBLE HORRIBLE motion blur. They ALL have more motion blur than even the worst Plasmas or CRTs. CRTs have NANOSECOND response times, Plasmas have MICROSECOND response times, and LCDS have laughable MILLISECOND response times. Sample and Hold is the other HUGE ISSUE with LCDs.
    LCDS that use 120hz or 240hz to try and reduce the DESIGN FLAW of LCDs do as much bad as good. They reduce motion blur somewhat but at the cost of HORRIBLE HORRIBLE INTERPOLATION ARFTIFACTS as well as the crappy Soap Opera Effect.
    The other HUGE GIGANTIC ADVANTAGE to CRTs and Plasmas is that they have MILLIONs of INDIVIDUAL LIGHT SOURCES called phosphors(laid out in triads). A 1080P Plasma has almost 6.3 million light sources for its almost 2.1 million pixels. Even The XBR8 only has DOZENS of light sources which is not enough to have the pure black background with a very small area of bright light such as a firefly in the dark that the Pioneer Kuro Elites and CRTs can do.
     
  2. Jun 10, 2009 #2 of 161
    LarryFlowers

    LarryFlowers New Member

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    Sorry Jack, you are missing the most obvious reason of all...

    Price!

    Also these days, power consumption is also a factor and, in spite of improvements made by the Plasma screen makers, same size plasma screens draw substantially more power than an LCD.

    Admittedly the Kuro Elite has one of the finest pictures I have ever seen... but sadly, Pioneer is dropping this product.

    Larry




     
  3. Jun 10, 2009 #3 of 161
    SayWhat?

    SayWhat? Know Nothing

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    Why write such a biased thread title?

    Why quote the entire post ?

    LCD over Plasma? Easy, cost, lifespan, servicability, weight (no glass screen on most LCDs), power consumption, etc. I've never seen any significant difference in picture quality between the two.
     
  4. Jun 10, 2009 #4 of 161
    BAHitman

    BAHitman Godfather

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    I guess it depends on your goal... if you are trying to set up a movie theater in your house and you have the dough to blow on it then get what makes you happy. Most people just want a TV and it's OK with them if it cost $600 and doesn't look quite as good as a $2000 power-sucking high-end plazma screen. Just the energy cost over the life of the TV is justification enough for most--especially with the newer LED backlit models

    I think the LCD TV's are great for the price point.
     
  5. Jun 10, 2009 #5 of 161
    sigma1914

    sigma1914 Well-Known Member DBSTalk Club

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    I like how you use Kuro and Magnolias as examples since everyone can afford a $5000+ set. :rolleyes: I don't care what "experts" or others who throw "facts" about what's better...As long as I like MY tv, that's what matters.
     
  6. Jun 10, 2009 #6 of 161
    Fontano

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    As other pointed out, IMHO 99% of it is because of $$$

    The other 1% is the FUD that is out there aboout plasma's.

    I personally own a Plasma and love it. However it is dated, it is several years old and only goes up to 720p (well slightly higher).

    With some of the new 1080p / 120mhz systems that I have seen, my jaw drops at the quality of the picture. And I cry a tear everytime I see the price on them compared to what I paid for my system.

    Don't get me wrong, I have loved having the system for many years vs getting one today. But sometime in the next couple years, I will be replacing it.

    And most likely, it will NOT be with a plasma because at the end of the day, the quality of the LCD display in my opinion are very good and going to the plasma simply isn't worth the price difference.

    And with more and more of the companies pulling out of the plasma development, that price point is going to continue to get wider and wider.

    Also with kids, it is a much easier pill (while being a very big one), if cricial damage is done to that lcd screen at a smaller $$ amount then a plasma at that much higher $$$$$
     
  7. Jun 10, 2009 #7 of 161
    hdtvfan0001

    hdtvfan0001 Well-Known Member

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    AMEN
    Pretty much said it all....with the addition of one thing....based on the "abandon ship" of the plasma platform by manufacturers the past 2 years...that's a risk many will not take.

    Sure Plasma looks OK...but...what happens when in 2 years you can't get support/parts?

    I live in a very large metro area, and only 4 places will service a Plasma, and almost 100 places will service an LCD.

    Just not worth the hassle.

    (Besides...I already own a space heater).
     
  8. Jun 10, 2009 #8 of 161
    Marlin Guy

    Marlin Guy Hall Of Fame

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    Jack,
    Love your music.

    But I also love my LCD.

    If we all liked the same things, we wouldn't be having this discussion because they'd only make one style of tv in one size.
    To each his own.
     
  9. Jun 10, 2009 #9 of 161
    bobukcat

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    Money is a good argument why not to get something like a Kuro but the lower end Panasonic and Samsung Plasmas are not that much more than a comparably sized LCD - they are ususally cheaper than a Sony LCD, and they easily outperform them in picture quality, particulary off-angle. Power consumption has been significantly lowered on these models as well, and while they don't match the LED edge-lit LCDs it's not like they are double or even 50% higher. Weight is another one people throw around to justify LCD, if you're hanging it on a wall what difference does it make if it weighs 45lbs or 60 lbs?

    The only times I would recommend an LCD over a plasma are:

    a) it's in a very bright room or a room with a lot of sources for glare
    b) there will be a static image on the screen for very long periods of time
    c) a small screen size is needed / desired.
     
  10. Jun 10, 2009 #10 of 161
    Fontano

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    Not the greatest of comparison there, as you are paying (again IMHO) 25% more on the product simply because the word SONY is on it.
     
  11. Jun 10, 2009 #11 of 161
    WestDC

    WestDC Well-Known Member

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    my eyes are bad, That's why I prefer an LCD.
     
  12. Jun 10, 2009 #12 of 161
    Chris Blount

    Chris Blount Creator of DBSTalk Staff Member Administrator DBSTalk Gold Club

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    I personally have never liked plasma. Too many things can go wrong and the good ones are very expensive.

    I'm also not a big LCD fan either since it still suffers the same problem as plasma. It uses chemicals to create a picture.

    I'm a DLP person myself. No chemicals. Just mirrors. Unfortunately the technology seems to be going away.
     
  13. Jun 10, 2009 #13 of 161
    hdtvfan0001

    hdtvfan0001 Well-Known Member

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    Not sure about that one at all....respectfully disagree...from firsthand LCD use experience at the 55" size level...
     
  14. Jun 10, 2009 #14 of 161
    bobukcat

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    I don't want to re-hash old threads too much but as I've pointed out before, there is no guarantee that parts will be more readily available in two years for an LCD you buy today rather than a plasma you buy today. I have a four year old DLP that parts (other than refurb) have been unavailable for going back almost two years. If it makes you feel better about your purchase, that's fine with me but I'll take a better looking picture anyday.
     
  15. Jun 10, 2009 #15 of 161
    hdtvfan0001

    hdtvfan0001 Well-Known Member

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    I'm with him ^^^^^^ on that.

    DLP is still going strong on the projector side, which I prefer there as well.
     
  16. Jun 10, 2009 #16 of 161
    hdtvfan0001

    hdtvfan0001 Well-Known Member

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    Me too...which is why I prefer my DLP projector. :D
     
  17. Jun 10, 2009 #17 of 161
    bobukcat

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    Even CRTs used chemicals to produce a picture so I'm not too worried about that. I like DLP for rear-projection but if you want to hang it on a wall your only option if front projection. They're certainly the best-bang-for-the-buck when you want a large screen size but I'm a little miffed about the poor reliability of the Mits DLP I bought 4+ years ago and don't really like the price of replacement lamps too much either.
     
  18. Jun 10, 2009 #18 of 161
    Chris Blount

    Chris Blount Creator of DBSTalk Staff Member Administrator DBSTalk Gold Club

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    That's true. I forgot about that. I have a 3 year old DLP 720p projector that is still going strong and picked up one of the last Samsung 61" LED/DLP Rear Projections sets in December. I love both! Within the next year I plan to start shopping for a 1080p projector. I hope to find a reasonably priced DLP version.
     
  19. Jun 10, 2009 #19 of 161
    bobukcat

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    Sure, but that was just an example and it's not like Sony doesn't sell a LOT of those expensive LCDs, there are plenty other LCDs that are more expensive than a comparable plasma. I'm going to abandon thread here because this is starting to turn into a re-hash of a previous thread about the new Panny plasmas but I just encourage people to actually consider and look at Plasma rather than just dismiss it because of all the FUD that's spread against it.
     
  20. Jun 10, 2009 #20 of 161
    Zellio

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    LED lcds are easily as good as plasmas.

    I have a few of the newer samsung lcd tvs. Plasmas for a long time were superior, not so much now.
     

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