[Tiger62]

An elderly female friend of mine just recently got Directv. She had just built a new house and, of course, the builder had run only two coax lines to the den, where her main TV is located. D* used both lines to connect her new HR21 and told her she couldn't get local OTA channels because she needed another coax run. I've told her to order an AM21 and I plan to install a CM4228, with amplifier, in the attic. I plan to cut one of her HR21 feeds, in the attic, and put the BBC there and diplex the output of the BBC with the antenna signal, and un-diplex the two signals at the HR21, with the antenna signal going to the AM21. I understand that D* doesn't endorse this, but I don't see a problem doing this...Am I right? (Just to eliminate future confusion, I might just put BOTH BBCs in the attic!) Comments?

 

[Dknow]

An elderly female friend of mine just recently got Directv. She had just built a new house and, of course, the builder had run only two coax lines to the den, where her main TV is located. D* used both lines to connect her new HR21 and told her she couldn't get local OTA channels because she needed another coax run. I've told her to order an AM21 and I plan to install a CM4228, with amplifier, in the attic. I plan to cut one of her HR21 feeds, in the attic, and put the BBC there and diplex the output of the BBC with the antenna signal, and un-diplex the two signals at the HR21, with the antenna signal going to the AM21. I understand that D* doesn't endorse this, but I don't see a problem doing this...Am I right? (Just to eliminate future confusion, I might just put BOTH BBCs in the attic!) Comments?

That works just fine. You shouldn't have any problems.

 

[MIAMI1683]

An elderly female friend of mine just recently got Directv. She had just built a new house and, of course, the builder had run only two coax lines to the den, where her main TV is located. D* used both lines to connect her new HR21 and told her she couldn't get local OTA channels because she needed another coax run. I've told her to order an AM21 and I plan to install a CM4228, with amplifier, in the attic. I plan to cut one of her HR21 feeds, in the attic, and put the BBC there and diplex the output of the BBC with the antenna signal, and un-diplex the two signals at the HR21, with the antenna signal going to the AM21. I understand that D* doesn't endorse this, but I don't see a problem doing this...Am I right? (Just to eliminate future confusion, I might just put BOTH BBCs in the attic!) Comments?

As Dknow said. As long as you diplex after the BBC's you are good to go. I would use both in the attic. Just make sure they are put it correctly. The said to the reciver is the output.

 

[RobertE]

Me, I'd actually do the job correctly and run a separate line for the OTA or get a SWM 8. Not do some workaround hack.

 

[Tiger62]

Me, I'd actually do the job correctly and run a separate line for the OTA or get a SWM 8. Not do some workaround hack.

That's still a possibility. I haven't determined the feasibility of an additional coax run (exterior wall...insulation, etc) but, from the lady's financial standpoint, the SWM-8 probably isn't feasible. But I'm also not sure that doing it the other way would be classified as "some workaround hack"... Opinions, and stuff.

 

[MIAMI1683]

Me, I'd actually do the job correctly and run a separate line for the OTA or get a SWM 8. Not do some workaround hack.

Glad to see you this morning RobertE .

 

[SledDog]

Me, I'd actually do the job correctly and run a separate line for the OTA or get a SWM 8. Not do some workaround hack.

You statement is the difference between an installer could care less and someone that's a professional...

And unfortunately, there are way to many hacks in your profession...

 

[MIAMI1683]

You statement is the difference between an installer could care less and someone that's a professional...

And unfortunately, there are way to many hacks in your profession...

He's right in a way. I have a direct feed (home run) for my OTA. In this case she's older and may need a work around. That's all. It's always better to do it "right". Sometimes its necessary to use a "work around"

 

[EricJRW]

I have 2 questions (if you don't mind):

1. How do the BBCs handle heat? It does not look like they were designed for an attic (well I'm thinking the space between ceiling and roof, not a finished room).

2. That being said, could someone describe what is required? Rough cost? My apologies for not searching, it just seems like the knowledge is already in this thread.

Personally, I like the dedicated coax idea, and I find myself having to do this same job... Sort of... I was lucky, I already had three coax runs. One was sat, one was OTA (antenna in attic) and one was RF distribution of OTA/CH 4 (I feed my IRD's A/V out into my VCR, and use the ANT out - If the VCR is off, OTA is passed) for the other rooms in the house.

Now 2 runs are for the sat, and I used the 3rd for the OTA antenna (got to feed that AM21), so at the moment none of the other TVs in the house (there's only 2) have an antenna, nor can they watch the broadcast from the VCR.

So I was going to run a 4th coax (through an interior wall), but I'm really curious about this diplexer idea. I'm lucky in the sense that all 3 coax in the attic already have f-connectors and couplers in the attic, as the builder ran the coax from out to in, and then it was ties into in the attic... So moving the BBCs and adding the diplexer up there would be a snap.

But in my mind it's 6 of one and half dozen of the other... I already have the coax, and it would be a single connection and easy to do - but it means crawling around in the attic - I did leave a pull-string in the wall though, so it won't be that bad. Whereas I would have to buy the diplexer stuff, and undo all the coax I just tucked away behind the new gear (to get at the BBCs).

I could go either way, but I'm leaning new coax run... But am am very curious about what's required for the diplexer method...

Well thanks in advance,

Eric

 

[MIAMI1683]

See the BBC's in the heat.. I have read that people have left them outside in a waterproof box. You know it gets hot in there. If you diplex your lines, you may be able to diplex all of them and get OTA into every reciever. Now if you do a home run, and split it (not sure if thats possible) to each room you will have to run a new line to every room. The latter may be the "right way", but the first may work and save a really big headache for you. Maybe even some time in the attic.

 

[EricJRW]

Oh, I only have one receiver, so a single coax (for now) is all the other rooms need. The ANT out from my VCR goes to a splitter in the attic, which feeds the RF to the 3 others rooms (of which only 2 have TVs).

 

[eakes]

My experience with diplexing and the 5 LNB dish was not good. I had a diplex configuration using the 3 LNB dish and all worked fine. However, when I changed dishes and did the usual 'move the BBC to before the diplexer' one of the OTA channels "disappeared".

The purpose of the BBC is to upconvert the lo-band of frequencies from the 5 LNB dish to an upper band which can be detected by the receivers. Unfortunately, there is bleed-thru of the lo-band signals at the output of the BBC as well as the desired upper band. Since the lo-band signals appear in the normal TV band, the stray signals present in the BBC output created enough 'noise' that it interfered with the desired OTA signal.

Therefore, diplexing OTA with a BBC may or may not be sucessful. A lot depends on exactly which OTA signals are present in a given locale and whether they lie in the lo-band pass-thru of the BBC.

 

[deboxer1]

How difficult would it be to just fish a home run for the ota? As soon as she has a problem with the receiver and call's Directv, a tech is going to be in her attic running a new line to get the diplexer off the sat line. And if it is determined the diplexer was put in after the installation , she can be charged for an upgrade instead of a service call protection plan or not.

 

[EricJRW]

Sounds like I know what I'm going to do now...

Now where did I leave my dust mask?

 

[veryoldschool]

My experience with diplexing and the 5 LNB dish was not good. I had a diplex configuration using the 3 LNB dish and all worked fine. However, when I changed dishes and did the usual 'move the BBC to before the diplexer' one of the OTA channels "disappeared".

The purpose of the BBC is to upconvert the lo-band of frequencies from the 5 LNB dish to an upper band which can be detected by the receivers. Unfortunately, there is bleed-thru of the lo-band signals at the output of the BBC as well as the desired upper band. Since the lo-band signals appear in the normal TV band, the stray signals present in the BBC output created enough 'noise' that it interfered with the desired OTA signal.

Therefore, diplexing OTA with a BBC may or may not be sucessful. A lot depends on exactly which OTA signals are present in a given locale and whether they lie in the lo-band pass-thru of the BBC.

My "first take" is the diplexers you're using aren't that good for out of band isolation. You might/should get better performance with another maker's diplexers.

 

[evan_s]

Might also try a new BBC since DirecTV will send them out to you for free anyway but yeah both the BBC and the diplexer should be blocking the ota frequencies to prevent interference with your OTA signal.

 

[RobertE]

Diplexing with the SWM is a workaround hack.

It's not supported nor approved by DirecTv. We will fail a QC with a flagrant violation if diplexers are found.

If we have to roll out on a service call and find diplexers, we are supposed to remove them to restore DirecTv service. If you still need whatever was diplexed going to that location, then things get a bit sticky. We have been told that we may charge custom labor charges for that new line. This can get expensive in a hurry.

Then there is the performance of the BBCS. The were designed for indoor use. Not outside in an enclosure or up in some 140+ degree attic. Expect them to fail.
You may also experience grater signal loss with the BBS away from the receiver. Since your reusing old cable it may not be able to that frequency spread with the BBCs remotely located. Then you have the OTA insertion loss. Each diplexer will kill off a portion of both your OTA and your SAT signal. Whats working today, may not work tomorrow. You've now also added a couple more points of failure to the chain.

Could go on, but those are some of the biggies.

You either do it right, or do it half assed and live with the results.