[Bender The Lab]

Wrong....they are NOT going bye-bye. They are declaring bankruptcy because they are trying to restructure their debt. They might (will?) renegotiate contracts with various teams, they may drop a few teams if they cannot renegotiate. This happens all the time in business. Bankruptcy doesn't mean they go belly up, but, everyone hears that term and thinks that. Teams will have to decide what they want to do now. Do they rework deals for less? Do they find another way to show games? Do they just not show the games at all? It's quite possible that fans get the short end of the stick, but it might not even be anything that fans notice is some markets.

Now, will RSNs exist like they do now in 5 years? I doubt it. In 10 years, almost definitely no. But this bankruptcy is not the end of even the Bally RSNs. At least not yet.

I do not think they even have 5 years, right now only, roughly, 40-50 Million Households ( of the 68 Million that still have a paid Live TV Subscription and depends on what package you have ) are paying the per sub fee, down from about 100 Million 9 years ago and the rate of losses are increasing every quarter.

Remember Dish/Sling ( about 10 Million subs), Hulu Live ( 4 Million) and YTTV (6 Million) do not have the RSNs.

Up to the 3rd quarter, Live TV Providers have lost about 5 million, expected to be about 7 million once 4th quarter is reported, so even if they get better contracts, they will lose another, at least, 10 million per sub fees, then here we go again, not making enough money to cover the contracts with sports teams.

And Bally Sports is the first, expect many more to do the same quite soon, the contracts with teams are just too much with way less revenue coming in.

 

[Herdfan]

How does DirecTV Stream not have the NFL Network? For a service the has a reputation for being sports centric, how do they not have this channel?

It is a dealbreaker for me.

 

[the2130]

How does DirecTV Stream not have the NFL Network? For a service the has a reputation for being sports centric, how do they not have this channel?

It is a dealbreaker for me.

Yes, that's a glaring omission from the DirecTV Stream channel lineup.

 

[harsh]

They are declaring bankruptcy because they are trying to restructure their debt.

With increased interest rates, restructuring the debt may the be last thing they want to do. The entities that now own the company are probably stuck with the debt unless they can write it off or sell it to someone else (typically at a loss) or somehow rebuild the company.

Reorganizations aren't always successful and perhaps less so when you start losing tentpole assets (teams or leagues).

 

[harsh]

For a service the has a reputation for being sports centric, how do they not have this channel?

I'm not convinced that DIRECTV STREAM (or Uverse) ever really shared in DIRECTV satellite's "Sports Leader" reputation.

At DIRECTV's asking price, it should be included regardless of any reputation or pre-conceptions.

 

[James Long]

With increased interest rates, restructuring the debt may the be last thing they want to do.

Their "restructuring" is turning debt into equity. Part of the plan is to give ownership to their creditors. The creditors will become investors sharing in the profits of the business instead of being paid interest on a loan. Bankruptcy also allows them to rework their obligations to the teams and other contracts.

 

[the2130]

I signed up with Steam at least 18 months ago, which was right after they went to unlimited DVR and 20 streams (without that I never would have). I'm back with Satellite for reasons I have gone through numerous times on the forum, but I thought the service was reasonably solid, though still needed a bit of work and a few missing channels. It was (for my purposes) better than YTTV when I tried that for a couple of weeks.

Just curious, why did you switch back to satellite?

 

[Steveknj]

Just curious, why did you switch back to satellite?

Mostly because family rebelled The short of it was that certain channels were not on DirecTV Stream that my kids watched, especially CW (our local CW is a NextStar affiliate and that's not carried by DirecTV Steam). My son watches all the superhero crap on that station. Now we were able to get around that before with Locast and using Channels DVR to record the Locast stream. When Locast was told to shut down, our only recourse as OTA anntena, and we never was able to get good enough reception to make it work. Due to RSNs (which aren't carried by other streamers) our only options were Optimum cable or going back to DirecTV Satellite. We tried cable because it was cheaper, but I hated pretty much everything about it from the terrible DVR to poor reception, and we only lasted a few weeks. So we got a good deal to go back to Satellite (but has since almost doubled, waiting for 2 year contract to be over so I can make a deal). To be honest, if DirecTV Stream got our CW channel (or, if the CW stopped showing stuff my kids liked), I'd probably go back to DirecTV Stream which would be cheaper for my use case, unless I can get a good deal again on Sat). The one foible that drove me nuts with Stream is the idea that they would "auto-pad" live events, but that only worked correctly sometimes, with no option to manually pad. I don't know if that's fixed or not. Obviously we get more channels on Sat, but a lot I can do without and not miss them (the one I would miss is NFL Network, but that could change with the change in ST to YTTV).

 

[the2130]

Mostly because family rebelled The short of it was that certain channels were not on DirecTV Stream that my kids watched, especially CW (our local CW is a NextStar affiliate and that's not carried by DirecTV Steam). My son watches all the superhero crap on that station. Now we were able to get around that before with Locast and using Channels DVR to record the Locast stream. When Locast was told to shut down, our only recourse as OTA anntena, and we never was able to get good enough reception to make it work. Due to RSNs (which aren't carried by other streamers) our only options were Optimum cable or going back to DirecTV Satellite. We tried cable because it was cheaper, but I hated pretty much everything about it from the terrible DVR to poor reception, and we only lasted a few weeks. So we got a good deal to go back to Satellite (but has since almost doubled, waiting for 2 year contract to be over so I can make a deal). To be honest, if DirecTV Stream got our CW channel (or, if the CW stopped showing stuff my kids liked), I'd probably go back to DirecTV Stream which would be cheaper for my use case, unless I can get a good deal again on Sat). The one foible that drove me nuts with Stream is the idea that they would "auto-pad" live events, but that only worked correctly sometimes, with no option to manually pad. I don't know if that's fixed or not. Obviously we get more channels on Sat, but a lot I can do without and not miss them (the one I would miss is NFL Network, but that could change with the change in ST to YTTV).

Thanks, that makes sense. I only had to sell my wife on switching to YTTV and she was fine with it once she understood that there was no equipment to install and that she would have the channels she likes to watch. I did sign up for Frndly TV to get the GAC Family channel she watches, but everything else she watches is in the YTTV lineup. It was an easy decision for me because I don't really need the RSN for baseball. With the new balanced MLB schedule, I will only have a maximum of 6 Cardinals games subject to blackout, which I can live with. If I needed the RSN, I might have signed up for DirecTV Stream during baseball season and switched to YTTV for the football season. Even with the overlap of the MLB and NFL seasons, I could have carried both DTV Stream and YTTV for the month of September and it would have cost less than a month of DirecTV satellite service.

 

[harsh]

Part of the plan is to give ownership to their creditors.

What are the advantages to a creditor in becoming an investor?

 

[David Ortiz]

Mostly because family rebelled The short of it was that certain channels were not on DirecTV Stream that my kids watched, especially CW (our local CW is a NextStar affiliate and that's not carried by DirecTV Steam). My son watches all the superhero crap on that station. Now we were able to get around that before with Locast and using Channels DVR to record the Locast stream. When Locast was told to shut down, our only recourse as OTA anntena, and we never was able to get good enough reception to make it work. Due to RSNs (which aren't carried by other streamers) our only options were Optimum cable or going back to DirecTV Satellite. We tried cable because it was cheaper, but I hated pretty much everything about it from the terrible DVR to poor reception, and we only lasted a few weeks. So we got a good deal to go back to Satellite (but has since almost doubled, waiting for 2 year contract to be over so I can make a deal). To be honest, if DirecTV Stream got our CW channel (or, if the CW stopped showing stuff my kids liked), I'd probably go back to DirecTV Stream which would be cheaper for my use case, unless I can get a good deal again on Sat). The one foible that drove me nuts with Stream is the idea that they would "auto-pad" live events, but that only worked correctly sometimes, with no option to manually pad. I don't know if that's fixed or not. Obviously we get more channels on Sat, but a lot I can do without and not miss them (the one I would miss is NFL Network, but that could change with the change in ST to YTTV).

The CW app wasn't an option?

 

[Steveknj]

The CW app wasn't an option?

Discussed with my son, and nope, he didn't like it (I think, but not positive that you can't record/skip ads) with the CW app. That was the end of the discussion. But now with the rumors that like many TV stations, that they will be jettisoning most if not all of their scripted stuff, and, with the Yankees no long carried on PIX-11, having it might not be a must any longer. But we'll see. I will say this, if we would go back to Stream, I'd buy an Osprey box for all of the TVs that are in use regularly. I'm old fashioned but I like the idea of channels and using the remote to directly go to a channel without having to go back to the home screen or guide to get there. I did get rid of two DirecTV boxes for rarely used TVs in favor or the App. It works fine for as much as I used the TVs.

 

[Steveknj]

What are the advantages to a creditor in becoming an investor?

The obvious is that they own skin in the game, so they could be motivated to make it work. Conversely, they could now use it as a tax write off, and not want to invest anything else. But just like anything you put money in, wouldn't you want to be able to make more money?

 

[the2130]

Discussed with my son, and nope, he didn't like it (I think, but not positive that you can't record/skip ads) with the CW app. That was the end of the discussion. But now with the rumors that like many TV stations, that they will be jettisoning most if not all of their scripted stuff, and, with the Yankees no long carried on PIX-11, having it might not be a must any longer. But we'll see. I will say this, if we would go back to Stream, I'd buy an Osprey box for all of the TVs that are in use regularly. I'm old fashioned but I like the idea of channels and using the remote to directly go to a channel without having to go back to the home screen or guide to get there. I did get rid of two DirecTV boxes for rarely used TVs in favor or the App. It works fine for as much as I used the TVs.

It's true the CW app doesn't allow ad-skipping. There are ways around that, but the CW's scheduling of shows makes them almost unwatchable anyway. They air a few episodes of a show, then break for a few weeks or months. Some of their shows from last season didn't end until August. The only CW show I still follow is Walker, and I only watch that when the episodes go to HBO Max.

 

[Steveknj]

It's true the CW app doesn't allow ad-skipping. There are ways around that, but the CW's scheduling of shows makes them almost unwatchable anyway. They air a few episodes of a show, then break for a few weeks or months. Some of their shows from last season didn't end until August. The only CW show I still follow is Walker, and I only watch that when the episodes go to HBO Max.

I don't know how that is, I've never used the app, and I only watch our local CW for Seinfeld reruns at bed time these days At the time I went to DirecTV Stream they had some Yankee games (which have moved to Amazon Prime) so I watched it more. As I said, my son watches all those comic shows, Riverdale, Batgirl or whatever stuff is on there.

 

[harsh]

I think, but not positive that you can't record/skip ads

Recording is not an option (it doesn't need to be as you're viewing on demand) and you cannot skip the ads.

 

[harsh]

The obvious is that they own skin in the game, so they could be motivated to make it work.

The creditors have had the same skin in the game all along. Finding someone to salvage the organization and provide an ROI now becomes a group effort.

Conversely, they could now use it as a tax write off, and not want to invest anything else.

Either way, it is probably the same loss. What do you expect "the bank" to do to turn the company around that they wouldn't have already discussed with the previous regime?

 

[the2130]

Recording is not an option (it doesn't need to be as you're viewing on demand) and you cannot skip the ads.

It's not an option through the CW app, but there are other apps that will record content from it.

 

[James Long]

What are the advantages to a creditor in becoming an investor?

It gives them a reason not to cut their losses and run. If I loaned you $10 you would owe me $10 plus interest and nothing more. But give me a stake in your business and I could end up with a better return on the investment than the interest. It could also turn out to be lower return but at least "a piece of the action" is better than simply defaulting on the loan.

 

[Steveknj]

The creditors have had the same skin in the game all along. Finding someone to salvage the organization and provide an ROI now becomes a group effort.
Either way, it is probably the same loss. What do you expect "the bank" to do to turn the company around that they wouldn't have already discussed with the previous regime?

A creditor with an ownership stake his more reason to want the network to be profitable. A creditor with just a "loan" just wants to be paid with interest. It's completely different. Once the debt obligation is done, the creditor is no longer involved in the company. As an investor, they are in it for the long haul.