[RaeAnne]

I am in desperate need for some expert help in getting my DVD Recorder hooked up and working with the VIP 625. I have worked for over a week and no matter what hookup I try, I can’t get the DVD Recorder to work correctly. I am so frustrated There are no companies around our area who will come and do hookups of components. I also have no friends or family who know how to do this. So I have been on my own and even though I think I’ve tried just about every type hookup possible, I am getting no where. I have searched your forums for answers to no avail. I found several hookups mentioned but none worked for me. (unless I was missing something) The best I've been able to do is to get a beautiful picture and to be able to record but I have no sound. If anyone would be kind enough to take the time to help me, I would be extremely grateful.

Here is a list of what I am trying to hookup:

VIP622
Toshiba Cinema Series TP61H95/TP71H95 TV with DTV hookup
Kenwood VR 309 Audio/Video Surround Receiver
GoVideo R6740 DVD Recorder

I would like to use the surround sound system but my main concern is getting the DVD Recorder to work. I would appreciate instructions on hooking the DVD Recorder directly to the VIP622. And if anyone has time, how to hook the entire system up.

I have diagrams I would be glad to e-mail to anyone if you'd like to see them. Please, please someone................. take pity on me!

Thanks so very, very much,
RaeAnne

 

[Ron Barry]

Take a look at the DVDR threads located in the Tips section. Might provide the information and answer the question you have.

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=64185

And :welcome_s

 

[harsh]

I am in desperate need for some expert help in getting my DVD Recorder hooked up and working with the VIP 625. I have worked for over a week and no matter what hookup I try, I can't get the DVD Recorder to work correctly. I am so frustrated

Take a deep breath.

• connect the ViP622's TV1 S-video connector to the corresponding AV in 2 connector on the DVD recorder (item #3 in the Go Video manual)
• connect the red and white RCA jacks on the ViP622's TV1 audio output to the corresponding AV in 2 connectors on the DVD recorder (item #4 in the Go Video manual)
• as directed on page 13 of the Go Video manual, press the [INPUT] button until you get to AV2-Rear.

At this point, you should be able to record whatever is playing on TV1.

Per page 99 in the ViP622 manual, plug a component cable from the ViP622 to the "DTV Interface Terminal" on the back of the TV (green, red, blue) and plug an optical cable from the ViP622 to an optical in on the Kenwood.

Note that you may have to tinker with the screen resolution to get satisfactory results on the DVD recorder.

 

[RaeAnne]

Thanks so much for the quick responses

Harsh, the hookup you gave me is the hookup I tried first and couldn't get it to work. This is the same hookup I found several days ago on the tips page that Ron mentioned. As I said in my first post, I thought maybe I had misunderstood the hookup and had done it wrong. After reading your post, I went in and tried it again.

I hooked up everything EXACTLY as you said. I even followed the diagram in my Go-Video manual with the numbers you so kindly gave me. It isn't working and this is what is making me so crazy.

No matter what input I put the DVD Recorder on, I get nothing but a black screen except in the DTV input. I get nothing but a black screen on AV2-Rear input.

I know I need to set my Toshiba TV on the input that the DVD Recorder is using but since in the above hookup, I have no cord running to the TV except the green, red & blue cable from the VIP622 to the DTV interface on the TV and an optical cord from the VIP622 to the Kenwood, all of the TV inputs come up black screen except the DTV input. Soooooooooooooo

I am assuming I need to run a cable from the DVD Recorder to the correct input on the TV to complete the hookup. On my Toshiba TV I have a choice of 6 inputs: TV, Video 1, Video 2, Video 3, Color Stream and DTV. The Color Stream input specifically says it's for DVD. I have another green, red, blue composite cable and have tried running it from the DVD Recorder to the TV Color Stream input.

NOW I can put my TV on the Color Stream Input, turn on the DVD Recorder and put it on the S-Video input and I have a picture of what is playing on the TV. On the DVD Recorder AV1 input.........black screen. On the AV2 input..........black screen. On the DV input............blue screen with arrows at bottom to scroll from picture to picture if viewing digital pictures. On next input it says DVD+R at the top of blue screen window and has a Go-Video logo in middle of screen. From this screen I can bring up my menus to either record or play back a DVD. But I have NO SOUND in any of these inputs.

I can record and I have a beautiful picture when played back. So the screen resolution I have is no problem. I just have no sound.

So I next tried running the optical cable from the VIP622 to the Go-Video Recorder optical in. I unhooked the Kenwood entirely. I then ran the red/white audio cables from the TV1 audio out on the VIP622 to the Toshiba DTV audio In.

Still no sound.

I have tried running a yellow, red & white cable from the DVD Recorder out to the Toshiba Video1 /Audio in and removing the red, blue and green composite cable. No luck.

I have sound when the TV is set on the DTV input only.

As I said, this is all driving me crazy. And I do need to mention that I have used this Go-Video recorder many times before this and it works perfectly. It wasn't until we had the new VIP 622 installed and the installers unhooked everything that I've had any problems. I asked the installers to hook everything back up but was told they can't do that because of liability issues if something goes wrong. They also told me that I could no longer use our VCR. Whether they meant because they had unhooked it or because it couldn't be done, I don't know.

I had many more choices of hookups on the our old Direct Tv receiver than I do on the VIP622 so I no longer have the same hookup options.

I hope I've made sense in how I've described things. If you or anyone else has ANY ideas, please let me know. I will try anything at this point.

Thanks so very much,
RaeAnne

 

[dbconsultant]

I'm running on memory so this may not be a valid suggestion but have you tried running the red/white cables from your 622 (TV1 I believe) directly to the DVD recorder's AV2 Rear along with the s-video from the 622 directly to the DVD recorder's AV2 Rear? Then run the outputs from the DVD recorder to one of your tv's video intputs. Change the DVD recorder to AV2 and TV to whatever input you plugged into and see if that works.

 

[David_Levin]

I agree with Harsh's hookup, but you do also need to run a set of connections from the DVD Recorder to the TV (so you can monitor the recorder).

You can use whatever ports are available. But, for best picture quality I'd suggest HDMI from 622 to TV & composite from DVDR to TV.

Don't forget that we're only talking about video here.

In all cases you're going to need to run an audio patch too. Probably analog (red/black) from 622 to DVDR & DVDR to TV & Optical from 622 to Stereo Receiver.

Then as dbconsultant mentioned, you must remember to select the correct source on both the DVD Recorder and the TV.

Another possible option is to connect the DVD Recorder as TV2. You then could record while watching something else. I don't use this because it's a slightly lower quality connection (composite as opposed to s-video) and doesn't allow for recording an anamoprhic DVD (don't worry about that until you get basic recording figured out).

I'm going to PM you my phone number. If you still stuck tonight, call me and maybe I can help talk you through it.

PS - Take a careful look at the optical on the DVDR. I'd guess it's an output not an input. I'm not aware of any recorder that can record Optical Audio. You need to run an analog (red/black) cable from the 622 to the DVDR (in addition to the s-video).

 

[David_Levin]

Also...
Don't forget to get some +RW (erasable) Discs so you can experiment with recording for less $$$.

 

[RaeAnne]

First of all I want to thank all of you guys for trying to help me. I really, really appreciate it.

I have read each post very carefully. I have printed them off to have them right beside me while doing the hookups.

Here is the current hookup I have:

Dish VIP 622:

S-video Out to DVD Recorder S-video In
Red/White Audio Out to DVD Recorder Red/White Audio In
Digital optical Out to Digital Optical In on Kenwood Surr System
PrPbY Video Out to Toshiba DTV PrPbY Video In
(I have no HDMI hookup available on my TV)​

DVD Recorder:

PrPbY Video Out to Toshiba TV DVD ColorStream PrPbY Video In
Red/White Audio Out to Toshiba DTV Audio In​

Kenwood Surround System:

Monitor Out to Toshiba Video/Audio In​

To Try Out My Hookup:

I am putting my TV on the Color Stream Input
(DVD Recorder hooked up to this input)

I am putting the DVD Recorder Input on S-Video Input (this is the only input that will bring up the picture on the TV so I can see what I'm recording.

It is the only input that will bring up the screen menus to either record or play anything. AV-1 comes up with a black screen, AV-2 comes up with a black screen.

None of the above has any sound what so ever. I must put my TV's Input back to the DTV input to see a picture and hear sound. When I put the TV back on this input, you can hear a click and the speaker comes on. Hearing this click has made me wonder if there was any setting someplace on my TV, DVD Recorder or the VIP to turn something on. I have searched and searched thru my menus and can find nothing.

It's almost like I need to run another Red/White Audio cable from the DVD Recorder to the TV's Color Stream Red/White Audio In so I will have sound on that Input. I'd try that but I'm out of hookups on the back of the DVD Recorder.
Does this make sense to anyone? Would I have to do that? Would this input not work if it didn't have an audio cable going to it?

I have never in my life been so frustrated. I know that my DVD Recorder was working perfectly before this new setup. But on the off chance that maybe something is wrong with it, I am going to hook it up to another tv and see what happens.

If any of you see anything incorrect on any of my above listed hookups, please let me know. I will try it first thing in the morning. I need the rest of the evening to unwind from the day's frustrations.

And David, I thank you for your offer of talking to me on the phone. That is so nice of you. I may have to take you up on it. I hate to bother anyone and always try to figure things out on my own but this time, I'm stumped and getting nowhere fast. Oh, and you are right on the DVD Recorder having Digital Optical Out only. Not Digital Optical In.

Again, I thank everyone who has responded! You are all great.

RaeAnne

 

[David_Levin]

If you are using the Colorstream input for the DVD Recorder you must also use the audio ports by the colorstream ports..... You shoud NOT be using the DTV audio ports unless you are ALSO using the DTV Video port.

When you select colorstream, the TV is selecting both the colorstream Video AND audio ports. The ports are linked in groups.

Also, I'm not sure what is special about the Colorstream Port vs DTV Port. Both are Component. You should check your manual. The DTV port might only support 720/1080 vs the Colorstream which might only be 480 i/p.

So, a standard DVD Player outputs 480 i/p. But an upconverting DVD Player would be 720p or 1080i (as well as 480). The 622 does all depending on the Display selection.

Make sure you can play back a pre-recorded DVD through the TV (amp off). This will validate the connection to the TV independant of the 622 to DVDR connection.

Also make sure:
The "Audio Center Channel" switch on the TV is "OFF"

AND that the DVD Recorder does not disable the analog audio out (red/black) when the Digital out is active (not likely, but I've seen this once).

 

[harsh]

You can use whatever ports are available. But, for best picture quality I'd suggest HDMI from 622 to TV & composite from DVDR to TV.

The TV in question has two component inputs and no DVI nor HDMI.

Probably analog (red/black) from 622 to DVDR & DVDR to TV & Optical from 622 to Stereo Receiver.

The AV receiver has two optical inputs.

I'd actually be inclined to try the TV2 RF output.

 

[David_Levin]

Sure, ultimately, RaeAnne will want to also connect digital audio from the DVDR to the AV receiver, but I'm trying to keep it as simple as possible.

Coax from the 622 might help, but I'm not sure the audio problem isn't between the DVDR and the TV. Need to get pre-recorded DVDs working first.

Found this in the DVDR owners manual:

Surround Output:
Sets your surround sound preferences.
Stereo
Dolby
OFF

It's not clear if this is referring to DD -> PCM downmixing for the Digital outputs, or if this might have something to do with the analog outputs (or both).

 

[dbconsultant]

If you are using the Colorstream input for the DVD Recorder you must also use the audio ports by the colorstream ports..... You shoud NOT be using the DTV audio ports unless you are ALSO using the DTV Video port.

When you select colorstream, the TV is selecting both the colorstream Video AND audio ports. The ports are linked in groups.

David, I think you nailed it - this is the first thing that sent up a red flag for me when I read her post detailing her set-up. The audio and video both must be hooked up to the same input for it to work!

 

[RaeAnne]

Okay, my brain has had a night's rest from this mess so hopefully I'll be able to understand what each of you are telling me. And hopefully I'll be able to write back in a way that I can make each of you understand me I appreciate you guys hanging in there with me on this. I know it's a pain and a lot of work for you.

David,

Thank you for explaining that when using the Color Stream port (or any port) you must use both the audio and video for that port as the TV is selecting both. That makes perfect sense. I did as you suggested on trying out the DVD Recorder on it's own by connecting it directly to the TV. I disconnected the Amp and the TV center switch is Off. I can play a movie fine. I have a beautiful picture and I can hear the sound. I'm not using the Digital Out on the DVD Recorder so that can't be turning off the analog signal. Don't know if this will be relavent but I brought up the menu you were questioning and even though I know it says Surround Output:

Stereo
Dolby
OFF

On my screen, it comes up with these choices:

Stereo
Dolby
DTS

I don't have the OFF anywhere. Don't know if that makes a difference or not.
I have the following settings set now but I've tried changing them in every possible combination to no avail.

Surround................Dolby.
Digital Out..............Bitstream or PCM. I'm using Bitstream.
DTS Out..................On or Off. I'm using On

Also on Playback Aspect Ratio: Mine is set to 16.9 Wide

I've also searched my TV's manual to see what the DTV port supports. It states "This advanced projection TV can receive digital broadcasts via a DTV receiver. The DTV Interface Terminal jacks are available for the Color Difference signals 1080i, 480p and 480i." So evidently the DTV port does support the needed 480i for the DVD recorder.

And where to go from here? I'm stuck and I have no idea what to try next.

Please let me know if anything I've added has helped.

Thanks Again!
RaeAnne

 

[David_Levin]

OK, since you are able to play (see and hear) a prerecorded DVD, your cables between the DVDR and the TV are good. DVDR setting are fine too. Keep this source selected on the TV.

Don't worry about aspect ratio (yet). Let's first get a signal from the 622 to the DVDR to the TV you can see AND hear.

So, let's review the cabling between the 622 and the DVDR.

You need 2 cables. S-Video & Analog Audio (Black/Red).

Use the TV1 outputs from the 622.

On the DVDR BOTH cables need to connect to the REAR ports labeled "AV IN2".
The Audio connects to the upper plugs marked Audio IN R/L.

Turn On the 622, DVDR, & TV.
On the TV select the same source you used for DVD Playback

Press the "Input" button on the DVDR remote sill you get to AV2-REAR.

Are we there yet?

 

[David_Levin]

On my screen, it comes up with these choices:
Stereo
Dolby
DTS

I don't have the OFF anywhere. Don't know if that makes a difference or not.
I have the following settings set now but I've tried changing them in every possible combination to no avail.

Surround................Dolby.
Digital Out..............Bitstream or PCM. I'm using Bitstream.
DTS Out..................On or Off. I'm using On

Also on Playback Aspect Ratio: Mine is set to 16.9 Wide

Those choices are a bit ODD. There is usually a way to select DTS but you also have a DTS Out setting under a different option (under surround & DTS Out). There is usually also a way to select the downmix for the analog outputs, but a DTS option doesn't make sense here.

Since your receiver supports DTS, those setting look fine.

 

[RaeAnne]

Just wanted to let everyone know that I finally have my DVD Recorder up and working correctly:hurah:

I want to thank every one of you who took the time to help. You've all been great!!!!!! This is a wonderful forum, full of good people and lots of excellent information. I feel so very lucky I came across it.

There is one person I'd like to give an extra special thank you to and that's David, who went over and beyond, with helping me both here and offline. You've been fantastic, David, and I want you to know that I appreciate it so very much. Your great details and explanations is what got me thru on this. And I'm sure anyone else who has this same problem will find this post very informative and helpful. I really can't thank you enough. I'm so grateful you took pity on me. You gave up a lot of your personal time to very patiently walk me thru this. I know there had to be times you were sighing and shaking your head at me but you hung in there. You also passed on several things that I didn't know before and I'm grateful to have learned. Most are posted here for others to read but one tip you gave me wasn't posted here and I'd like to pass it on to other novices such as myself.

I thought I needed a special digital coax cable to run the sound from my DVD Recorder to my Kenwood surround. I planned to go into Radio Shack and purchase one. David told me, "there is nothing special about a coax digital audio cable." "Any RCA cable should work fine (Video or Audio) just make sure you use the same color at both ends." "Don't let them sell you a high $$$ cable."

I had a spare cable, used that and was up and running in seconds, making no special trip or spending any extra money. I know this is old hat to all of you experienced guys but this is just the type of tip we novices need and can use. So I'd ask everyone reading this, the next time you are trying to help anyone, please pass on any tips no matter how trival you think they may be. Any and all tips are valuable to those who have never done any of this before.

Even though it's been a very frustrating week and a half for me, I can now honestly say it was worth it. (NEVER would have thought I'd say THAT)The knowledge I've gained by doing this myself is tremendous and so valuable.

Again, a big, big, big Thank You............ David, Harsh, DBConsultant & Ron

Extremely grateful,
RaeAnne

 

[David_Levin]

I'm glad you got it working. The learning curve here can be huge and it is difficult providing this level of support through message boards. Congradulations for sticking it out.

Once you get recording working, the next big thing is understanding how 622 format selection effects the recorded DVD.

Getting the cables hooked up is child's play compared to this giant piece of confusion.

First let me remind everyone that there's some great pointers here:
http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=64185

There's a group devoted to recording "DVDR related Topics"

I'm going to try and write this up because I don't think it's all been covered in one place (and it comes up A LOT).

Some DVD Information:

DVDs can exist with two different aspect ratios (length/height). 4:3 and 16:9. 16:9 DVDs are called anamorphic. In both cases, the DVD is usually 720x480 (the shape of the pixel changes).

Most commercial widescreen DVDs are anamorphic. Movies can be wider then 16:9. In this case the DVD is recorded 16:9 and the picture is shrunk until the full width will fit. The top/bottom is no longer tall enough to fill your screen so the dead space is filled with black (called a letterbox). (Side bars are usually called a Pillar Box)

A widescreen move can also be recorded on a 4:3 DVD using the same method. The letter box just gets (A LOT) bigger.

The problem here is that a portion of your 720x480 pixels are being wasted recording blackness. This costs the DVD resolution (picture quality). An anamorphic (16:9) DVD is wider then a 4:3 so is wasting fewer pixels recording black space.

Anamorphic DVD on a 4:3 TV:
So say you have an Anamorphic (16:9) DVD and a 4:3 TV. If nothing else happens the wide image would be horizontally scrunched onto you narrow TV and everyone would appear tall and skinny (hmmm, I like the sound of that).

Anamorphic DVDs have a hidden flag (indicator) to identify itself to the DVD Player. If a DVD is Anamorphic AND the "TV Type" is set to 4:3, the DVD Player will vertically scrunch the image to return the tall/skinny people back to their proper shape (creating a letterbox on the TV). But remember, in this case, the letterbox is not actually recorded on the DVD (wasting pixels), but is being created by the DVD Player.

Now on to the 622:

If it's hi-def source and the 622 is in 16:9 mode you will be getting an anamorphic image out of the TV1 video ports (and the TV2 ports if in "Single" mode). When you record this on your DVD Recorder (DVDR) you'll be recording an anamorphic DVD. This is the best resolution you can get.

Problem is most DVD recorders don't set the 16:9 flag so DVD players don't create a letterbox for 4:3 TVs. This doesn't matter if you only using a 16:9 TV since they don't require the vertical squish.

There are two solutions to this problem.

Solution #1:
If you're playback is mostly on a 4:3 TV (say making a Disc for a friend), you can have the 622 create the top/bottom letterbox. You do lose some resolution, but for a 4:3 TV you're not missing much.

Set the 622 Display Type to 4x3 #2 to have it create the letterbox.

Solution #2:
Leave the 622 in 16:9 mode and record the Anamorphic DVD. Now we need to set the anamorphic flag on the DVD so a regular DVD player will create the top/bottom letterbox. This can be done on a PC using a freeware program (ifoedit).

Get the Program and install it:
http://www.videohelp.com/tools?tool=IfoEdit
http://download.videohelp.com/download/Ifoedit0971.zip

Do your initial recording to an RW (so you don't waste a disc).

Pop the Disc in a PC DVD Drive and use Windows Explorer to copy the video_ts folder (there's no content protection on discs you create).

Use ifoedit edit to set the anamorphic flag (instructions):
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=8568824&highlight=ifoedit+anamorphic#post8568824
Finally, reburn the DVD with your favorite burning program.

-------------------------------------------------------

Appendix:

There are some interesting side effects when watching 4:3 material on a hi-def (16:9) channel....

4:3 isn't wide enough to fill 16:9 so there are bars on the sides. Also, with 4:3 #2 the 622 does the vertical squish to format the widescreen anamorphic for the 4:3 TV.

So, now you have side bars (from the broadcaster), and top/bottom bars from the 622. No reason to record all the bars. Use the 622 Zoom (#/format button) to remove the bars.

 

[RaeAnne]

Thank you, David, for all of the above information on format selection. I've wanted to get back to you since Friday but today is the first I've had a chance.

I had no idea recording could be so complicated if you want a perfect picture on 4:3 tv's. I've been reading on all of your links and all the info boggles my mind. And yes, you're right........learning this will be much, much harder than the hookup of the DVD Recorder.

I purchased DVD Rw's yesterday to experiment with as you suggested. I have downloaded the infoedit program. I read your post last Friday and clicked on all the links you provided. I only had time to skim thru them on Friday, thinking I'd come back today when I had more time. However, today I can't find the post of how to actually use infoedit to set the 16:9 flag. Maybe it's just me and I'm not seeing it or that page is down right now.............Anyway, I did a search on Google and came up with these detailed instructions:

http://www.dvdr-digest.com/articles/ifoedit_16-9flag_print.html

I've printed this off and after Thanksgiving, I'll give this a try. I may have more questions later on.

Also I'm interested in learning how to connect the DVD Recorder as TV2 as you mentioned in one of the posts above. You stated:

"Another possible option is to connect the DVD Recorder as TV2. You then could record while watching something else. I don't use this because it's a slightly lower quality connection (composite as opposed to s-video) and doesn't allow for recording an anamoprhic DVD (don't worry about that until you get basic recording figured out)."

I've wondered what the TV2 connections could be used for ever since we've gotten the 622. I most likely won't use this either as you say it's a lower quality but I'd still like to understand how to do this. Unless I'm missing it, I don't see the information in the 622 manual. I always like to learn and understand everything I can about any new component we get.

If anyone has time to explain the above, I'd appreciate it and I'm sure other newbies would appreciate it too.

Thanks,
RaeAnne

 

[Yelobug]

I am so greatful to have found your post, RaeAnne! It helped me as no other post has! Of course, it goes without saying, that my hat is off to all the wonderful replies you had from those in the know! I printed this lenghthy post off (12 pages!) and started drawing my lines on my own created blue print (I took copies from my manuals of all the back panels from my HDTV, ViP622, a few years old DVD Recorder/VCR combo, and an even older surround sound! that I then cut out and taped onto one sheet of legal paper to make several copies of my "setup"). I had previously asked my brother-in-law and Circuit City employees for their opinions after showing my "blue-print" of my setup earlier in the day yesterday! I kept everything out from the wall and was bound to figure it out. That's when I had my nose in this website and post. For the life of me, I don't even remember what I put to eventually end up in this website! But, boy, am I glad that I did! After not being able to record from my DVR since upgrading to the HD DVR 622 and my new HDTV since late this summer (even after having the Dish Network installer, and two brothers tinker with the setup)! Anyway, thanks to everyone who gave RaeAnne her inspiring input on proper setup! I'm not a technically connected female but I was able to follow the logic here in your post! I had to sign up to let you and the others (David, harsh, etc) know!

Therese