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· Cool Member
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16 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I have an NEC 50XM5 that I will be connecting to a HR20-700 on Monday. Looking at the HR20 manual it looks like Native mode would be the best choice.

I have an HR10-250 & am sick of having to switch the mode manually when I go from SD to HD and vice versa. If I read the manual correctly, native mode means I wouldn't need to do this anymore.

Is my assumption correct?
Are there reasons not to go Native?
 

· Registered
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5,451 Posts
denno said:
I have an NEC 50XM5 that I will be connecting to a HR20-700 on Monday. Looking at the HR20 manual it looks like Native mode would be the best choice.

I have an HR10-250 & am sick of having to switch the mode manually when I go from SD to HD and vice versa. If I read the manual correctly, native mode means I wouldn't need to do this anymore.

Is my assumption correct?
Are there reasons not to go Native?
It really is a matter of choice. To answer your question, "yes", it will do it automatically. I find it works well in my setup.

I recommend playing with it and test your scenario to see which you prefer.
 

· Registered
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897 Posts
I use Native on. The only disadvatage that I know of is that takes 3-8 seconds to change channels when there is a format change between the source you are switching from to the source you are to. (ie- 480i show to a 720p or 1080i show, or any combination thereof)
 

· DirecTV 10yr+ Customer
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1,010 Posts
I posted this in other threads....more of a process.

1) If you have high-end 1080P TV and want a set-n-forget setting, and can live with channel/format change delay, put NATIVE ON. This is also true if you feel your TV has much superior scalar than HR20....or you want to use the TV settings to adjust picture. {STOP: Don't Read Further}
2) Find out what your native resoulution of TV is....1280x720, 1368x768, 1920x1080
3) Turn Native mode OFF in the HR20.
4) Make sure 16:9 is set in HR20 as Display Type
5) Make sure on your TV you have set for Full Screen or Full Passthrough....descriptions vary.
6) If you have 1280x720 or 1368x768 native resolution TV set HR20 resolution to 720P only...make sure Format button has you one of these settings. {STOP: Do Not Read Further}
7) If you have 1920x1080 native resolution turn 720P and 1080i only on in HR20....make sure Format button has you on this setting.
8) Now, watch a bunch of material....SD, HBOHD (1080i), Sports (720P), Local HD, OTA HD.....use the Format button on Remote and switch between these formats as you view the material. You can decide to leave on one or the other. Note, since Native is OFF you forcing this format you toggle to be sent to the TV.

This above process should work for everyone since it allows for each user to setup and easily check their preferences.
 

· Godfather
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290 Posts
denno said:
I have an NEC 50XM5 that I will be connecting to a HR20-700 on Monday. Looking at the HR20 manual it looks like Native mode would be the best choice.

I have an HR10-250 & am sick of having to switch the mode manually when I go from SD to HD and vice versa. If I read the manual correctly, native mode means I wouldn't need to do this anymore.

Is my assumption correct?
Are there reasons not to go Native?
This damn NATIVE setting thing will drive you crazy. It is very confusing, at least for me.

It has been discussed at depth in many threads on this board. Go here to read everything you need to know about Native settings:
http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=75108

I've read all the explanations from the very knowledgeable people. Some of the experts will tell you Native off is the way to go and others Native on. Some of the experts here suggest selecting just 720 with Native off. But I did NOT like that setting at all. I'm a Native ON guy :)

I have come to the conclusion that with my set-up (HR20-Samsung 5687 1080 res.)
Native ON with 720 and 1080 selected res. and pillar box on SD stations, is the best for me. I do not have to make any changes when switching channels and my picture is beautiful. It's a little slow in the channel changing but , the only time that bothers me is when switching between football games.

**DISCLAIMER** I AM NOT AN EXPERT ON THIS SUBJECT LIKE SOME OF THE OTHER POSTERS. IT IS JUST MY OBVERSATION WITH MY OWN SET-UP.
 

· Cool Member
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27 Posts
I would prefer to have native on....too much work to figure out the others.

Is the slow channel change time when using native something that we can expect to be improved in the future with a software update?:confused:
 

· Cutting Edge: ECHELON '07
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9,882 Posts
Tiger Tony said:
This damn NATIVE setting thing will drive you crazy. It is very confusing, at least for me.

It has been discussed at depth in many threads on this board. Go here to read everything you need to know about Native settings:
http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=75108

I've read all the explanations from the very knowledgeable people. Some of the experts will tell you Native off is the way to go and others Native on. Some of the experts here suggest selecting just 720 with Native off. But I did NOT like that setting at all. I'm a Native ON guy :)
Well, there is no *best* setting for this. It's really all up to the individual and what works and looks best for their setup. For me Native off is best. For you Native on may be best. That's why it's there as an option along with all the format options. It will take trial and error to find out what works best for you. All we can do is suggest what works best for us but that may not be what's best for you.
 

· Registered
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bonscott87 said:
Well, there is no *best* setting for this. It's really all up to the individual and what works and looks best for their setup. For me Native off is best. For you Native on may be best. That's why it's there as an option along with all the format options. It will take trial and error to find out what works best for you. All we can do is suggest what works best for us but that may not be what's best for you.
BINGO!
 

· Premium Member
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41,526 Posts
marsmadness said:
Is the slow channel change time when using native something that we can expect to be improved in the future with a software update?:confused:
I don't think this "lag" will improve with a software update as it is due to the hardware changing on both the HR-20 and your TV. I don't claim to be an expert [we have enough of them] but have a good feel for how it is working & what's going. [My opinion only].
 

· Legend
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145 Posts
Here's a data point: I got my HR20 about a week ago, and did a LOT of testing of native vs. various fixed outputs to see which gave better picture quality with my Panasonic Plasma. As I expected, I got noticably better results using native. In most cases where I used a fixed output from the HR20, there was a definite softness compared to native.

This makes sense: any fixed pixel display, like a plasma, LCD, DLP etc has to scale most or all inputs to the native resolution of the display panel, because most panels don't exactly match any broadcast resolution. (A common example would be scaling a 1080i input to a 1366x768p LCD.) If you have the receiver set for native, then the signal only undergoes one scaling transformation - the one in the display hardware. On the other hand, if you set the HR20 to a fixed output, say 1080i, then every 480 or 720p signal is going through TWO scaling transformations: a) up to 1080i in the HR20 and b) back down to progressive native panel resolution in the display. And, every such transformation is going to take a little bite out of PQ.

Beyond this, the HR 20 is built to a fairly low price point ($800 retail) given everything that's in there. This means the scaler has to be a pretty low-end chip compared to the scaler in a multi-thousand $ big screen.
 

· Legend
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137 Posts
On my RPTV Native mode gives a better picture on SD material.

Better to deliver 480i direct to the TV then upconvert it to 1080i and introduce artifacts. Plus my RPTV has all sorts of picture improvement settings for 480i interlaced material that are not available at 1080i (not to mention SHARPNESS setting is disabled on HDTV).

Cons are its slower as the TV has to change resolutions.
 

· Premium Member
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I hope by now we can all agree that what works well for one user will NOT be the same for another, since the components of everyone's system are different. This discussion is more like who will win the Super Bowl than a technical debate. Everyone will have a different setting [opinion] for what looks best to them.
There is no right or wrong for this topic? Right?
 

· Cool Member
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27 Posts
I switched mine to native today. I have the Sony SXRD, so I will be interested to see if I notice an improved picture quality. In the past, I left the HR-20 on 1080i pillar box for everything, and the SD channels were horrible. Even some of the HD shows have been less than superb, so I can't wait to see if this improves things.
 

· AllStar
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68 Posts
veryoldschool said:
I hope by now we can all agree that what works well for one user will NOT be the same for another, since the components of everyone's system are different. This discussion is more like who will win the Super Bowl than a technical debate. Everyone will have a different setting [opinion] for what looks best to them.
There is no right or wrong for this topic? Right?
Wrong. while its true
that different combinations of gear will give different results and may need different optimum settings, there are a lot of basic rules that are ALWAYS true
that should never be broken. Just because you can set something definately wrong doesnt mean you should waste time trying it. One of the would be
buying a true 1080 display and then setting your box to output 720 all the time
just to minimize channel resync time. Someone actully suggested or was doing that. thats the kind of thing Im talking about.
 

· Premium Member
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JCO said:
Wrong. while its true
that different combinations of gear will give different results and may need different optimum settings, there are a lot of basic rules that are ALWAYS true
that should never be broken. Just because you can set something definately wrong doesnt mean you should waste time trying it. One of the would be
buying a true 1080 display and then setting your box to output 720 all the time
just to minimize channel resync time. Someone actully suggested or was doing that. thats the kind of thing Im talking about.
I hope I can speak for more than just myself. GIVE IT A REST. You have had everyone [or almost] try to explain what you've been missing, but you still persit. Your posting have been read. We know your point(s). Some may agree and others don't for the reasons they've tried to explain. I think your "defiantly wrong" is well put.
 

· AllStar
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veryoldschool said:
I hope I can speak for more than just myself. GIVE IT A REST. You have had everyone [or almost] try to explain what you've been missing, but you still persit. Your posting have been read. We know your point(s). Some may agree and others don't for the reasons they've tried to explain. I think your "defiantly wrong" is well put.
HUH? I will post at will just like anyone else. I am not missing a damn thing and stand by all my
statements and posts so far. If and when I make a factual error or end up agreeing with an
alternate viewpoint I will say so, but in this case, so far, on this topic, I dont.
Live with it.
 
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