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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi,

We own a condo in a small complex (7 units) in Oakland, CA. We on 2nd floor of 2 story complex. I ordered DTV install 4 weeks ago and was very clear we would have to have a roof install as we have obstruction from our tree preventing balcony signal. This similar to my neighbor that has DTV and his dish on the roof. No HOA issues.

So the tech came out this morning and looked at our place. He bluntly stated that as of 8 months ago he can no longer go on roofs for install and cancelled my order and left. I asked if there is workarounds for this (8 month ago thing) he stated no and said you can have 2nd opinion if you want and bailed.

So contractors recently redid our kitchen and were on the roof for something with skylight. I am not an OSHA expert etc. but this was all little vague to me. Has anyone experienced and just had to go with one of the other providers? (ATT,Comcast) I was really looking forward to doing business with DTV.

Thanks much
 

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Genius.
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The dish can be installed anywhere on your roof that does NOT requires the tech to leave his ladder.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Thanks much.. Wish he would have simply told me with our place that he felt could do from ladder. Not sure what the 8 month mention meant. Assuming i don't have another option other than back to Comcast.
 

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sfrogner said:
Not sure what the 8 month mention meant.
Up until recently, some DIrecTV contractors didn't pay much attention to OSHA rules. The one that services Long Island (Mastec) is one of those companies. Over the past year or so, they have gone from no enforcement to strict enforcement.

RBA is correct. if there is a DirecTV retailer in your area who does their own installs, you're more likely to get the installation that you want.
 

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OSHA rules don't apply to all private contractors.

Mastec might have to follow them, But I don't if I'm a paid sub contractor.
I can climb all over your roof on one leg, and no one can say or do anything.

 

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damondlt said:
OSHA rules don't apply to all private contractors.

Mastec might have to follow them, But I don't if I'm a paid sub contractor.
I can climb all over your roof on one leg, and no one can say or do anything.
You, as self employed are not covered under OSH Jurisdiction, however your employees should be, as is mandated by state or federal law.
 

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RBA said:
Try finding an independent Directv installer. If they don't work for DTV they may have different rules to follow.
They don't have different rules to follow, unless is a self-employed individual they must follow OSH regs, that they refused to follow them is different story.
 

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Roof work is possible under OSHA regulations ... but protection must be provided.
("... each employee on a walking/working surface 6 feet (1.8 m) or more above lower levels shall be protected from falling by a guardrail system, safety net system, or personal fall arrest system.")

Providing fall protection adds to the cost of the installation. Most installers will pass on the installation rather than provide protection.

All employers and employees should follow OSHA. Sometimes employees will violate OSHA just to get the job done. That is not a good thing. Employers need to back up their employees when they refuse to violate OSHA rules ... instead of having a "just send someone who will do it" attitude.

If one can find a local company with their own installers they may be more willing to go the extra mile and pay for fall protection. Or look for a better location for the dish. My experience with a local company is that they don't stop at "standard install" ... they will work safely but creatively to get the installation completed. Your experience may vary.
 
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peds48 said:
They don't have different rules to follow, unless is a self-employed individual they must follow OSH regs, that they refused to follow them is different story.
The law states if less than 10 employees, Osha regulation don't have to be met.
If you are a Sub contractor same applies.
Read the rules on OHSA. ,
I can also have my attorney contact you and you setup a meeting just as I had to do.

I own 3 business I know the OSHA laws.
My Building company employs 15 employees, all covered under workman's comp, also they get medical benifits, and by law OHSA rules must only be met on commercial, state and federal jobs.
And those rules have to be inforced upon us by the General contractor of those jobs.
Not by me or my employees.

Now our Restaurant, employs 35 people, they all have to follow OSHA rules and regulations, and also have to have various safety checks.
But you also are responsible for hundreds of customers a day well being. There are also fire codes that have to be met.

Now my Communications company again are sub contractor's, 5 people are the only the company's employees. The rest have their own trucks, and insurance and also work for multiple companies.
The subs have to follow OSHA rules only again when climbing a Utility pole, working in commercial, state and federal jobs.

Now as James said some people will do anything to get the job done.
Which maybe true, but it doesn't mean it isn't done with the safety in mind.
My guys aren't just average Joe's that just got hired to install Dish and Directv satellites with no life experiences what so ever.
Mastec employees are like a box of chocolates, you never know what your going to get.
I've seen the way they setup their extention ladders, I wouldn't want them on a roof. Where is OSHA when they are setting up their ladders?

If you don't know your own limitations and have good common sence ,then you don't belong in any contracting business.
OHSA isn't going to save you.
 

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James Long said:
Rood work is possible under OSHA regulations ... but protection must be provided.
("... each employee on a walking/working surface 6 feet (1.8 m) or more above lower levels shall be protected from falling by a guardrail system, safety net system, or personal fall arrest system.")
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James
You have you ever heard of roof Jacks? How about a roof ladder?
Pump Jacks ?

Again most residential contractors don't have this harnesses, ropes and nets.
Not because they don't want to pay for it, But because it is not required.

We have all the stuff, and When we did Cigar International we used the roof harnesses. No nets are required. No requirement on rope length either.. well that's pointless.
See you still need common sense.
Everyone was tripping over their ropes more than anything.
When we built Pa visitors center for Delaware state forest we used them
All except for the roof harnesses and nets.
All that was required was 1 guy had to sit on the roof and watch yous.
Yep a joke.

Again if 10 or less Employees.

You can ridicule me all you want, but we have a clean record, other than a few bumps and bangs, it's all covered under the thousands I pay a month in comp insurance.

We had one guy fall off a ladder and rupture his spleen .
He was taken by ambulance, and also drug tested which all my employees are required to do and failed his drug test, well Pa workman's comp, said sorry sir.
You are not eligible for benifits.

So again OSHA isn't going to protect you over everything.
 

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The law varies based on if you are working on the roof or on the roof working.

State and local laws may enhance federal OSHA rules. Please check with your own legal counsel on what is required in your area.
 
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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Update:

We had another installer come out (2nd opinion) and this was not a subcontractor it was from DTV. The installer came out understood needed to get on roof called his manager. Manager came out and supported him getting on roof.

This team did leave the ladder. Helmet was worn if thats the safety gear one person mentioned. They were very surprised on first installers decision.

Still not sure what happened with first subcontract installer though all good. It does seem a little vague to me on ladder no ladder, 8 months etc etc but will leave that up to you guys.

Surprising thing though i would say is that this first subcontractor with very vague procedures almost cost DTV a customer. That could add up quickly.

thx for all responses
 

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Yep congratulations.
Also a hard hat is not an OSH requirement on a roof.
So again if he took out a helmet or a hard hat that was his own decision or it was his boss, or company policies.
Not OSHA!
 

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west99999 said:
All DirecTV techs are required to wear hardhat when using ladders.
That's company policy.
Agree.
But there is no OSHA requirements on hard hats on the roof.
As soon as you are clear of anything that could potentially fall from an above location or work station, you can remove your hard hat.
You do not need a hard hat on a roof.
You also don't need a hard hat set up a ladder and climb it either.
A hard hat doesn't protect your head from a fall, it protects your head from falling objects!

Everyone has their own policy.
OSHA just sets a guideline.
 

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1926.100(a)
Employees working in areas where there is a possible danger of head injury from impact, or from falling or flying objects, or from electrical shock and burns, shall be protected by protective helmets.


The interpretation of "possible danger" is important. Note that the regulation includes "from impact" separate from "from falling or flying objects". Is it possible to suffer a head injury when setting up a ladder? Is it possible to suffer a head injury while walking under a ladder? An abundance of caution says yes, wear a helmet.
 

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James Long said:
1926.100(a)
Employees working in areas where there is a possible danger of head injury from impact, or from falling or flying objects, or from electrical shock and burns, shall be protected by protective helmets.


The interpretation of "possible danger" is important. Note that the regulation includes "from impact" separate from "from falling or flying objects". Is it possible to suffer a head injury when setting up a ladder? Is it possible to suffer a head injury while walking under a ladder? An abundance of caution says yes, wear a helmet.
Have you ever used a hard hat James?

My guess is no.
Because if you're falling off of a roof, chances are the hard hat will be already on the ground long before you get there.
It certainly won't be still on your head.
Hard hats are not even required in Walmart Distribution Center, and they have all kinds of Over head danger.

You might be a mod here and certainly know how to help run this forum, but you certainly don't have any OHSA training or experience.
 

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damondlt said:
Have you ever used a hard hat James?
Yes, I have. I keep one on my desk so it is handy any time I need to go and enter a place where it is needed.

damondlt said:
Because if you're falling off of a roof, chances are the hard hat will be already on the ground long before you get there.
Hard hats are not fall protection. They are head injury protection. However, chin straps are available for those who risk losing their hat while working.

damondlt said:
Hard hats are not even required in Walmart Distribution Center, and they have all kinds of Over head danger.
I do not work for Walmart. Their distribution center rules do not apply to me or my employer. Their rules also do not apply to DirecTV or any contracted employee unless said employee is on Walmart property and is asked to follow a rule more stringent than those set forth by their own employer.

damondlt said:
You might be a mod here and certainly know how to help run this forum, but you certainly don't have any OHSA training or experience.
Personal attacks are unneeded. But you don't know my paid job, you don't know my resume. You are quite literally speaking from ignorance. Volunteering to help this forum does not require the use of a hard hat. Please do not make me put my "mod hat" on.

The Thread Starter has had their problem solved. If there is any further discussion on the topic of roof work it is welcome. Otherwise, thank you for participating.
 
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