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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello,

I am a long time DTV customer that is looking to upgrade a standard install to HD. Currently the dish is mounted on the chimney, which is at the opposite end of the house from the main receiver (about 75' of cable between the main receiver and the current point of entry). The house is surrounded by trees so I am afraid that I am going to lose LOS with the current dish mount.

I think that I will need to move the dish to a pole mount in the front yard to make sure that I have a clean LOS in the future. In order to clear the trees I will have somewhere between 115' and 150' of cable run between the dish and the current house entry point, depending on where exactly I place the dish. In this configuration I think that I would have about 230-240' of cable between the dish and the main receiver.

Will this work? I plan on having the pole already set and plumb. I am also planning on digging the trench myself.

Looking at this site, I would think that I am looking at a SWiM setup. From what I understand I am lookig at one wire from the dish to the house entry. My thought was that I would place the splitter(?) at the house entry. Do I understand this correctly?

Thanks in advance
 

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Legend
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Are you also going to run the cable, or let the tech supply it?

And if you are going to trench for cable that far, do three things, 1)go down at least 28"
2)use 1" pvc will gluded together from the pole to the house, with 90deg sweepsat each end then 3) if you are suppling the cable put four RG6 in the pipe.

If you are not suppling the cable, put a 1/4" pull rope to pull the cable.

By doing this you have jumped way out in front of any possible changes to the system in the future.

Be sure you weather seal the ends after you run the cable.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Thanks for the replies. One question for Cabletech. Why would I want to run 4 cables back to the house? When I was looking at the writeups of the SWiM system it indicated that there was a single wire from the dish to the first connection in the house. My plan was to run two so that I had a spare. What are the additinal two lines for (sorry for not understanding).

Thanks
 

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MANC
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If you ever go over eight tuners then you need a SWiM 16 and a conventional LNB. This requires four wires from the dish. If you intend to call DirecTv dont put a pole in the ground till I get there.
 

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Is your system a 5 lnb or only 3 lnb? If 3 lnb your cuurent location will work almost 99 percent of the time. the span of the 99 101 and 103 is very small. About 1 foot at most at arms length. let the tech try the install at the current location. Or pay a lot to have them move it for no reason.
 

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Legend
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veryoldschool said:
I'm guessing you may be looking to add an amp.
250' without a splitter is just doable, but that means only one receiver.
Sonora makes amps for this.
Looking at the distance of 150' to the house, plus another 80' from distribution, which system would be more robust, especially during rain-fade events.

A) SWM-Integrated LNB w/amp

B) Slimline LNB w/four cables feeding a SWM-8 module at distribution (150"), plus the 80' from SWM module.

Also, would it make a difference either way if multiple receivers are involved?

Thanks In Advance!!

Good Luck!!
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
My current system is a 3 LNB system. I have decided to leave everything as is and call in the upgrade order. I plan on being here when the tech shows up and I am going to ask him for his opinion. FWIW I have pretty good reception with the current situation and have very little rain fade.

I will report back once the install happens (or not, as the case may be).

Thanks
 

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Tech_1438 said:
Looking at the distance of 150' to the house, plus another 80' from distribution, which system would be more robust, especially during rain-fade events.

A) SWM-Integrated LNB w/amp

B) Slimline LNB w/four cables feeding a SWM-8 module at distribution (150"), plus the 80' from SWM module.

Also, would it make a difference either way if multiple receivers are involved?

Thanks In Advance!!

Good Luck!!
Good question, and since you're adding an amp to A, it wins hands down.

This doesn't mean that B can't work as well, if you add an amp to it too.

The SWiM has an automatic gain control, which will amplify the output signals if the input drops [rainfade]. It has this to compensate for the coax & splitter losses to the receivers.
The SWiMLNB has no loss between the LNB and the SWiM, which means the AGC is adding gain for only rainfade.
When you add coax loss between the LNB and the SWiM [SWM8, SWiM-16, etc.], this loss adds to more rainfade.
The SWiM to receiver is designed to work with 30 dB of loss.
The LNB to SWiM has no loss with the SWiMLNB.
The LNB to SWiM modules are designed for less than 50' of coax [loss].

So if you have more loss between the LNB and the SWiM, you need to amplify the signals before the SWiM.
If you have more loss between the SWiM and the receivers, you need to amplify the signal.
If you manage the losses, both will work the same, as you're amplifying the weak signals.
Following this, you could use an amp between the dish and the SWiM, and between the SWiM and receivers, and be able to have the same rainfade "resistance" with very long coax runs.
 

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fac said:
My current system is a 3 LNB system. I have decided to leave everything as is and call in the upgrade order. I plan on being here when the tech shows up and I am going to ask him for his opinion. FWIW I have pretty good reception with the current situation and have very little rain fade.

I will report back once the install happens (or not, as the case may be).

Thanks
You might take a look at this: http://www.dishpointer.com/

You can enter your address and get a map of your location. Select the SAT you want and it shows a line pointing to it.
You can drag the pointer around to see where trees may block the signal, and get a distance and height they need to be below.
With a bit of playing, you should get a good idea of any problems.
 

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cabletech said:
Are you also going to run the cable, or let the tech supply it?

And if you are going to trench for cable that far, do three things, 1)go down at least 28"
2)use 1" pvc will gluded together from the pole to the house, with 90deg sweepsat each end then 3) if you are suppling the cable put four RG6 in the pipe.

If you are not suppling the cable, put a 1/4" pull rope to pull the cable.

By doing this you have jumped way out in front of any possible changes to the system in the future.

Be sure you weather seal the ends after you run the cable.
He's in North Carolina. When you run underground wiring you have to get below the freezing point. That is 18" in NJ. I'd think in NC it might be even less.

Other than that, good post.

Rich
 

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Tech_1438 said:
Looking at the distance of 150' to the house, plus another 80' from distribution, which system would be more robust, especially during rain-fade events.

A) SWM-Integrated LNB w/amp

B) Slimline LNB w/four cables feeding a SWM-8 module at distribution (150"), plus the 80' from SWM module.

Also, would it make a difference either way if multiple receivers are involved?

Thanks In Advance!!
Your post caused me to think about rain fade. I had my two SWM16s installed in 2010 (I think that's when MRV was installed), and I have had not had many rain fades since. Seems as if there were more when using the old system. That make sense?

Rich
 

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Rich said:
Your post caused me to think about rain fade. I had my two SWM16s installed in 2010 (I think that's when MRV was installed), and I have had not had many rain fades since. Seems as if there were more when using the old system. That make sense?

Rich
You've got about 10-15 dB of gain that kicks in when the signals get weak, that you didn't have before.
While it isn't a "cure all" for rainfade, it helps reduce it.
Had a storm come through here Friday night which cause some fade for a few mins. The radar showed lots of yellow, orange and red.
 

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veryoldschool said:
You've got about 10-15 dB of gain that kicks in when the signals get weak, that you didn't have before.
While it isn't a "cure all" for rainfade, it helps reduce it.
Had a storm come through here Friday night which cause some fade for a few mins. The radar showed lots of yellow, orange and red.
So, it's not my imagination. I usually go to the Weather Bug when I do get rain fade and I usually see a weather cell right above my area.

Rich
 

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Geek til I die
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It is especially bad when the cell is between you and the satellte, and contains a lot of hail in the upper anvil. At my latitude, I dont get any rain fade when the storm is actually over me, and pouring out rain, I get it about 10 minutes before the storm gets here, when the radar shows it to be about 6-12 miles to my south/southwest. I can actually watch this signals drop on 103 first, then 101, then 99, and by the time it gets to 99, 103 is coming back.

FWIW, I have a 1 Meter dish and still get rain fade in those type storms. The local PBS station, which uses KU, has a 30 foot dish, and occasionally has rain fade as well.
 

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Davenlr said:
FWIW, I have a 1 Meter dish and still get rain fade in those type storms. The local PBS station, which uses KU, has a 30 foot dish, and occasionally has rain fade as well.
There are very few frequencies that get through. IIRC around 2 & 4 GHz are the ones least affected.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Thanks for the tip on dishpointer. I had found that site and looked at the bearing lines but I did not catch the height tool. I think that I am going to be ok because the bottom of the dish is probably 30' off the ground.

Thanks for the replies and the help.
 
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