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Hall Of Fame
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I hope this isn't an ignorant question. It relates to the lackluster interface speed (responsiveness) of my HR10-250 Dtivo vs. my HR-21s. Does anyone know the processor speed and RAM size of each?
 

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The Shadow Knows!
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I don't know the speed of the HR2x CPUs, but I think the TiVo was 80MHz. Processor speed and RAM become less important in this sort of device because of all of the special-purpose chips in the DVRs.
 

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Mr. FixAnything
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itzme said:
I hope this isn't an ignorant question. It relates to the lackluster interface speed (responsiveness) of my HR10-250 Dtivo vs. my HR-21s. Does anyone know the processor speed and RAM size of each?
The info for HR20 has been posted here. You could explore your HR21 disk (just temporary use external one for that) and read system logs.
 

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FROM what i understand it's coding/software
 

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The Shadow Knows!
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HR21s decode MPEG4 which is a lot more processor-intensive. I'm sure that's part of it.
 

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Stuart Sweet said:
HR21s decode MPEG4 which is a lot more processor-intensive. I'm sure that's part of it.
But H21s decode MPEG4 and run like a "bat out of hell". It seems like a lot of it is the "recording management" on the software side. I still see the UI "pauses" that seem like the processor is temporarily consumed with some kind of "housekeeping" tasks (since I don't see any tie to other concurrent activities). Just my viewpoint with an H21, HR21 and HR10 still active.
 

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I can't believe that this is still an argument. The HR2X series is orders of magnitude faster than the HR10-250's. My Brother-in-law has my old HR10 and it is slower than molasses at doing any functions. MY HR20 flies through anything I throw at it. Never slows down, freezes, etc.

I understand everyone loved their TiVo's. I was one of their 1st 1000 subscribers using the original Sony SVR2000. It was beautiful and set the standards.

But times change and we must change with them.
 

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Regardless of which one has a faster processor, the difference in speed is probably just as dependent on programming. If you have a Mac, an XP machine, and a Vista machine, all with the same hardware, they will do different tasks at different speeds. I'm sure it's the same with DVRs.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Wisegoat said:
I can't believe that this is still an argument. The HR2X series is orders of magnitude faster than the HR10-250's. My Brother-in-law has my old HR10 and it is slower than molasses at doing any functions. MY HR20 flies through anything I throw at it. Never slows down, freezes, etc.

I understand everyone loved their TiVo's. I was one of their 1st 1000 subscribers using the original Sony SVR2000. It was beautiful and set the standards.

But times change and we must change with them.
This has nothing to do with Tivo lement. The reality is I use both and like both, for different reasons. But when I flip over from the HR20 to the older HR10, I just start clicking away at commands- everything just flies and responds. I feel in control. When I flip back over to the HR20, I have to slow down in order to get "into its responsiveness rhythm". That is just a fact, at least for me. Interesting, you can actually see the lag time by watching the consoles blue light react fairly instantly to a remote command-- an instant (sometime a second or so) then goes by before the unit carries out the command. Try it while in the guide and using page down.

So here's another common example- has anyone ever clicked "Menu" and you don't see an instant response? So your reflexes tell you to click it again (hmm, maybe I didn't aim right or push hard enough)... You click again only to see the menu screen flicker On then Off. The same often happens when you press Guide. Or other command. That's the lag I'm tryng to describe. That never happens to me on my HR10-250. And again, I love hr HR-21, so please don't flame me for not 'changing with the times' .

And I believe you if you HR20 never slows down, but my HR21 sure does. Can we swap? I'll pay shipping and send you one of my two HR21s, and you can see for yourself.
 

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Hmmm, well I have an HR21, and while I still feel like the TiVo is more robust as far as basic DVR features go, the speed is one of the things I like about the HR21. At least when talking about things like going through the menus, lists, and guide. But I do feel like the TiVos are more responsive with the transport functions. FF, RR, play, etc all work instantly and smoothly on the HR10, but I still don't feel "connected" while controlling playback on the HR21. It's almost as if on the TiVo, playback is handled by dedicated circuitry... no matter how bogged down the rest of the system is, that stuff always works smoothly. With the HR21, I feel like it is a faster machine overall, but the playback functions seem to be funneled through the same system as all the other functions, and therefore are less responsive compared to the TiVo.
 

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kymikes said:
But H21s decode MPEG4 and run like a "bat out of hell". It seems like a lot of it is the "recording management" on the software side. I still see the UI "pauses" that seem like the processor is temporarily consumed with some kind of "housekeeping" tasks (since I don't see any tie to other concurrent activities). Just my viewpoint with an H21, HR21 and HR10 still active.
RIGHT. my H21 is super fast. i don't understand why they can't get the HR21 to perform the same.
 

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I use a new TiVo S3 for recording OTA and I find it to be slower than my HR20.

Having said that, when I hooked up networking to my HR20, it was noticeably slower, so much so that I disconnected it from the network just to get the speed back.
 

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Godfather
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The HR21 is newer, and therefore almost certainly has more memory and processor power than the HR10-250. What the HR21 needs is better/more efficient software.

My HR21 is "sluggish," especially in responding to the remote. The poor response to the remote is irritating.

For example, when you search for a show by name, it freezes momentarily after the first letter. You can press the second letter, but nothing will happen. Even worse, the second letter is not buffered until the unit unfreezes. It is just lost. There is no indication to the user as to what is happening.

These kinds of user interface problems are almost certainly software issues. If a DVR needs time to process before it can go forward, it should always display a "processing" splash screen

The great advance with the TIVO was that the software worked well, even with a slow CPU and very little memory. Its software basically did more with less. The TIVO handled its resource conflicts well, and generally responded snappily to the remote.
 

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Legend
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without question the HR2x GUI interface is MUCH slower than Tivo HR10-250 with 6.xx software. HR10-250 was slower with 3.51, but 6.xx sped things up quite a bit. I have an HR20-100, HR21-100, and HR10-250. both the HR2x's are slow to respond to remote cmds. i have to wait for the receiver to catch up with me. not the case with HR10-250. it responds almost immediately to remote cmds.

HR2x is much faster for handling recording scheduling and stuff like that. but for speed while moving around in the GUI and accessing the guide, HR10-250 kicks the crap out of HR2x.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
drill said:
without question the HR2x GUI interface is MUCH slower than Tivo HR10-250 with 6.xx software. HR10-250 was slower with 3.51, but 6.xx sped things up quite a bit. I have an HR20-100, HR21-100, and HR10-250. both the HR2x's are slow to respond to remote cmds. i have to wait for the receiver to catch up with me. not the case with HR10-250. it responds almost immediately to remote cmds.

HR2x is much faster for handling recording scheduling and stuff like that. but for speed while moving around in the GUI and accessing the guide, HR10-250 kicks the crap out of HR2x.
First, thanks for the confirmation. Based on other similar posts, and how some folks get defensive, I would tend to believe we're the norm and not the exception---the interface on the HR2x is, as you said, "MUCH slower than the Tivo."

That said, I didn't post this to gripe about the HR20. I'm trying to figure out if the issue is hardware or software. I participate in CEs and occassionally see improvements to the sluggishness, but nothing dratstic. If the problem is hardware (inferior chips, processor, or memory), I have a feeling we just have to live with the problem. BUT, if its software, I'll stay optimistic that one day it'll get snappier.

Side note: I wonder if some of this is a perception of speed issue. The Tivo gives you sound feedback as soon as you click a command (if that option is turned on). Your mind confirms the command, so you're less likely to keep pushing commands and getting frustrated trying to find the rhythm. Just a thought.
 

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drill said:
HR10-250 was slower with 3.51, but 6.xx sped things up quite a bit.
Perhaps this is why I felt the HR10 was slower than the HR21 (with the exception of it's playback responsiveness, which was always perfect). My HR10 stopped getting updates when I switched to VoIP. It's running two year old software.
 

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Godfather
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itzme said:
First, thanks for the confirmation. Based on other similar posts, and how some folks get defensive, I would tend to believe we're the norm and not the exception---the interface on the HR2x is, as you said, "MUCH slower than the Tivo."

That said, I didn't post this to gripe about the HR20. I'm trying to figure out if the issue is hardware or software. I participate in CEs and occassionally see improvements to the sluggishness, but nothing dratstic. If the problem is hardware (inferior chips, processor, or memory), I have a feeling we just have to live with the problem. BUT, if its software, I'll stay optimistic that one day it'll get snappier.

Side note: I wonder if some of this is a perception of speed issue. The Tivo gives you sound feedback as soon as you click a command (if that option is turned on). Your mind confirms the command, so you're less likely to keep pushing commands and getting frustrated trying to find the rhythm. Just a thought.
Since you participate in the CEs, did you not see a major performance improvement with CE 0250? I still have an HR10-250 on version 6.4 and two HR21-700s on 0250 and can not see much difference between the HR10 and HR21 now especially for trick play. The HR10 still beats the HR21 for fast forward though.
 
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