Introduction and beginner questions...

2936 Views 26 Replies 9 Participants Last post by Diana C, Jan 29, 2012

Coolerman

Discussion Starter · Jan 25, 2012

Hello all, I have been lurking around here for a couple of weeks trying to learn enough to at least ask semi-intelligent questions. I think I can now do so.
I admit I don't know squat about satellite stuff. Until recently I have always had cable TV. However being an industrial electronics tech by trade, I feel I can be easily taught what I need to know.

Here is my situation:

I just built a new log home (moved in December 10th). I pre-wired it with 2 RG6 quad shield cables and 2 Cat5E cables to each room that will have a TV/internet/phone. There will be a total of 5 locations for TV including my remote shop. These cables all go to the basement "storm room" where I have a structured wiring center (Leviton 280). I have power and access to a ground point at that location. Currently all cables are unterminated. All RG6 connectors will be the PPC XL compression type and will be made with Direct TV approved tools.

Now I also have a 24' x 40' external shop about 50' away from the house. The storm room is on that side of the basement. There are three 1 1/4" conduits run underground between the shop and the storm room. One of these conduits goes all the way to the far side of the shop where it goes into a small junction box with an outlet in it. This conduit has 2 RG6 cables,and 3 Cat5E cables in it with enough coiled up inside the box to reach the outside corner of the shop where I want to mount a Direct TV Dish. We are going with the Whole HOME DVR setup.

There is about 20' between where I want to mount the dish and the junction box where I want to mount the PI. From the junction box in the shop to the Leviton box in the basement (where I want to mount the SWM) is about 85'. So total distance between the dish and the SWM would be 105'. From the Leviton box to the furthest TV is also about 85'.

After reading many threads, it seems there are some distance issues I am going to have. I read that the max distance is 60' between Dish and SWM and 100' between SWM and the receivers. Is that still true? (It was an old thread)
Is there anything I can add, like some kind of amp between the Dish and the SWM, to be able to hook it up as I planned? I am trying to avoid having the dish mounted on the house for aesthetic reasons. Any help on this and all other suggestions for this installation would be greatly appreciated.

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1 - 20 of 27 Posts

Go Beavs

· #2 · Jan 25, 2012

Hello and :welcome_s to DBSTalk!

If you're looking to use a separate SWiM module in the basement of the house, you're going to need 2 more cables from the basement to the dish. For HD, you need 4 cables. I'm not sure what the max distance is from the dish to SwiM module though. 105' might be a little long... I'm sure others can confirm or deny this.

If you use a SWiM LNB, this post has some max recommended cable lengths from the dish to receivers using various splitters. Going this route would only use one cable from the shop to the house.

veryoldschool

· #3 · Jan 25, 2012

Go Beavs said:
Hello and :welcome_s to DBSTalk!

If you're looking to use a separate SWiM module in the basement of the house, you're going to need 2 more cables from the basement to the dish. For HD, you need 4 cables. I'm not sure what the max distance is from the dish to SwiM module though. 105' might be a little long... I'm sure others can confirm or deny this.

If you use a SWiM LNB, this post has some max recommended cable lengths from the dish to receivers using various splitters. Going this route would only use one cable from the shop to the house.

Ideally the dish to SWiM should be no more than 45' [ish].
Will it work at 105'? Yes, but it will also not have the full range it should, since there is more cable loss than it was designed for.
Using a SWiMLNB doesn't have this problem, but is limited to eight tuners.

TAK3210

· #4 · Jan 25, 2012

You don't say what receivers you're planning to have at the five locations. That will tell you how many tuners you have to account for.

Coolerman

Discussion Starter · #5 · Jan 25, 2012

OK, wow, there is a lot of information to absorb on this subject for sure. As you can see I'm not up on the lingo just yet. Please continue to school me on this.

I was planning on just calling D* and telling them come hook me up with whole house DVR, so whatever they usually install for the dish, connecting equipment and receivers is what I would get.
To start there will only be three receivers total. One HD- DVR and two HD receivers. Later we will add the other two HD receivers if needed.

So if they install the latest "stuff" will these distances work? I can mount the SWM in the shop and easily pull two more RG6 cables to it but then the total distance to the last receiver will be about 150'.

veryoldschool

· #6 · Jan 25, 2012

Coolerman said:
OK, wow, there is a lot of information to absorb on this subject for sure. As you can see I'm not up on the lingo just yet. Please continue to school me on this.

I was planning on just calling D* and telling them come hook me up with whole house DVR, so whatever they usually install for the dish, connecting equipment and receivers is what I would get.
To start there will only be three receivers total. One HD- DVR and two HD receivers. Later we will add the other two HD receivers if needed.

So if they install the latest "stuff" will these distances work? I can mount the SWM in the shop and easily pull two more RG6 cables to it but then the total distance to the last receiver will be about 150'.

sounds like you're making more out of this than you need to.
DirecTV will install the SWiMLNB, so "you'll be fine".
150' is close to the limit when they use an 8-way splitter, but this would only be when you're adding the other receivers "if you do", and there is still some margin so it shouldn't be a problem.

TAK3210

· #7 · Jan 25, 2012

Coolerman said:
...I was planning on just calling D* and telling them come hook me up with whole house DVR, so whatever they usually install for the dish, connecting equipment and receivers is what I would get...

Have you considered ordering the Home Media Center (HR34 receiver)?

Coolerman

Discussion Starter · #8 · Jan 25, 2012

Cool! That is a load off my mind. I spent a lot of time pulling all these cables, mounting boxes and running conduit! I should have done more detailed research on this in the beginning, but simply did not have the time. Working full time at one job, coming home and working a second job in the basement building wiring harnesses for old Toyota Land Cruisers AND trying to supervise the building of the house just did not leave much spare time in the last 16 months.

I will go ahead and schedule the phone company to come out and install the phone/DSL service. After that is working I will call D*. In the meantime I will continue reading here and coming up with the next set of questions. I need to learn more about HTPC's, Windows Media Center, and streaming and ....

Coolerman

Discussion Starter · #9 · Jan 25, 2012

TAK3210 said:
Have you considered ordering the Home Media Center (HR34 receiver)?

Yes that was the receiver I choose when I was on their web site configuring what I wanted. What can you tell me about it in addition to what they had on the web site?

veryoldschool

· #10 · Jan 25, 2012

Coolerman said:
Yes that was the receiver I choose when I was on their web site configuring what I wanted. What can you tell me about it in addition to what they had on the web site?

The biggest impact the HR34 would have is since it has 5 tuners, it only leaves you 3 HD receivers left, before the SWiMLNB is maxed out.
Once you exceed 8 tuners, you must move to the SWiM-16, which is where cabling may become an issue.

Go Beavs

· #11 · Jan 25, 2012

If the OP was to go with a SWiM-16, he could put it in the shop and use the 2 cables already pulled to the house for the two legs of the SWiM-16. That should work pretty slick with what he's already got.

Coolerman

Discussion Starter · #12 · Jan 25, 2012

Ah... that won't be an issue. We have no kids, it's just the two of us. 5 locations pretty much covers the whole house and the shop. If I need to watch TV in a location other than those, I can simply run a cable to that location then swap cables on the SwiM. Can't see us ever needing to do that. Reading up on the H34 now...

trh

· #13 · Jan 25, 2012

The HR34 $99 price for new customers ends in (I think) 16 days. Whether there will be a follow-on new customer pricing discount(s) is unknown. So don't delay on your order.....

TAK3210

· #14 · Jan 25, 2012

Coolerman said:
Yes that was the receiver I choose when I was on their web site configuring what I wanted. What can you tell me about it in addition to what they had on the web site?

I don't know anything more about the HR34 than what they probably have covered on the web site. Just wanted to make sure you knew about it. It seems to fit into your description of what you want. Although, if you did decide to add those two extra locations later, that would put you at 9 tuners. You know, what I'd probably do, if I was still in the "wiring mode" is run those two extra cables from the basement to the shop that Go Beavs mentioned and I think you'd be pretty well setup for anything. But, that's just me. You can also just wait and pull them when/if they're actually needed.

Coolerman

Discussion Starter · #15 · Jan 25, 2012

Go Beavs said:
If the OP was to go with a SWiM-16, he could put it in the shop and use the 2 cables already pulled to the house for the two legs of the SWiM-16. That should work pretty slick with what he's already got.

Here's a good question: When D* sends out a tech to do the install, what kind of input do I have with him? Can I tell him this is what i want, and here is where I want it? Will he measure the distances to see if the "standard package" will work, or actually measure anything? I keep seeing that shame thread sticky in the back of my mind...

Coolerman

Discussion Starter · #16 · Jan 25, 2012

trh said:
The HR34 $99 price for new customers ends in (I think) 16 days. Whether there will be a follow-on new customer pricing discount(s) is unknown. So don't delay on your order.....

Oh geeeez, thanks! Just what I needed: MORE PRESSURE! :lol:

Can I order now and delay installation for a couple of weeks to allow the phone company to get a phone line in place? I assume I have to have either a phone line or internet in order for the D* installation to proceed?

TAK3210

· #17 · Jan 25, 2012

Coolerman said:
Here's a good question: When D* sends out a tech to do the install, what kind of input do I have with him? Can I tell him this is what i want, and here is where I want it? Will he measure the distances to see if the "standard package" will work, or actually measure anything? I keep seeing that shame thread sticky in the back of my mind...

The installers I dealt with were more than willing to do what I wanted, but they can be limited to what equipment they have on the truck. In my case, the first installer didn't have the LNB I needed, so he made the equipment changes to the order and set up another appointment for a couple of days later. The second visit went without a hitch. Another thing, you mentioned the coax connectors in your original post I think. The installer will make those using his own connectors, if you want.

Go Beavs

· #18 · Jan 25, 2012

Coolerman said:
Here's a good question: When D* sends out a tech to do the install, what kind of input do I have with him? Can I tell him this is what i want, and here is where I want it? Will he measure the distances to see if the "standard package" will work, or actually measure anything? I keep seeing that shame thread sticky in the back of my mind...

I'm sure you can work with the installer to get what you want. If anything is "outside" the standard installation, there will probably be additional charges but they should let you know what you're getting into before proceeding.

trh

· #19 · Jan 25, 2012

Coolerman said:
Can I order now and delay installation for a couple of weeks to allow the phone company to get a phone line in place?

Wait until the promotion is about to expire and place your order (that gives you two weeks). They will have a date that depending on the installer, might be a few weeks later. But it could be in a couple of days; just don't accept that date and schedule it later.

carl6

· #20 · Jan 26, 2012

You don't have to have phone and/or internet, but it is desired. You should be able to get an install without either being available. However, subsequent connection to your LAN would then fall on you.

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