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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Hello ... again. I have two other threads that I started due to my moving my recently installed DirecTV dish ... they are: I moved my dish ... dithering screw question | DBSTalk Forum & skew angle question | DBSTalk Forum.
Today my wife had some things she wanted to do, so I determined I was gonna get my recently moved dish as best as I could. I did correct the skew as it was "off" and even if done to compensate for the initial pole being off plumb, I now had my pole "plumb". When I looked at the skew it was past 66 degrees, it needed to be 64.6 degrees. I had a TV on the porch with me, spent well over an hour, and the best I could get was 95% on a very few transponders on 101. The skew change did seem to help other satelites some. Finally, I was ready to call it quits.

Then like a bolt of light from the sky, it hit me (well, it hit the dish first). I noticed that the shadow of the porch overhang was getting near the dish, but the shadow of the LNB had a ways to go to being centered. When the LNB shadow was near center of the dish, a good deal of the dish was shaded. That 33" x 22" oval dish defines a column of energy 23,449 miles long, and a chunk of it was missing. I realised that I was never gonna get 100% under that overhang. The LNB is below the collumn of energy, it gets the reflections from the dish. The sun just acted like a pointer. You can stand behind it, imagine a point from the dish center and it is clear, but that signal isn't just a point. LOS is like a laser, but even it isn't a 32" x 22" oval.

I took the dish loose, hung it from the porch railing safely, and moved my pole mount about a foot or so downward, made sure it was plumb. I had marked the pole and mount so I returned it, spent a bit going through fine tuning steps, and now a majority of 101 is mid 90%s. Instead of just a few in the 90%s, it's just a very few of the 32 that aren't up in the 90%s now. I even have some 97%s. I think it's a good bet that lowering it verticaly uncoveredd some of the dish to the satelites, but not all. I'm OK, I like where it's at, 99 and 103 both look happier too with mostly some 70%+ and 80%+, several 89% readings, and it'll be the lone snow flake that finds the dish surface here where it's at now.

This is before moving it again today. I know the sun's elevation is not the same as the satelites, but it shows where the edge of my roof blocks a dish surface when the LNB is near center.
Tree Television antenna Font Gas Plant


You can see below that only the very edge of the dish is out past the roof edge, my winds come from the left side of the picture here. If anything, snow or sleet or even rain that falls here, if it misses the roof, it'll likely miss the dish too but if it falls plumb, it'l just nip the dish edge.

Tree Wood Twig Sky Trunk


I could move it further outwards, but then it would be vulnerable to ice and snow ... so I'll call it good until a problem pops up.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 · (Edited)
Hate to be the bearer of bad news but if you’re getting 70 and 80 still either you’re pointing is off or the dish is bent.
But I was only getting 50s on most of those on 99 and 103, and I might even still be having some blockage by the overhang? Those "mostly 70 and 80% readings " were like up to near 90s. Lots of 87, 86, some 88 / 89 like stuff ... I worded it badly I see so I fixed it. My last / 2nd DirecTV dish back in the 20-teens was often gathering snow, I still have a long broom I adapted so we could easily sweep it clear from the porch. I won't have that with this one. My first one never got snow, but it was really well protected.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 · (Edited)
Something was wrong!...It was me. I was not waiting long enough to see results, I thought I was just not getting anything in places. I thank you for your patience.

As a refresher, 11-03-2022 I moved my dish for the second time, this time lowering it a bit over a foot to maybe let it see satelites better out from under the porch roof overhang and then I did my best to peak it with TV on porch from basement reciever, using tones. I corrected skew too.

11-04-2022 at 12:01 AM I started testing all my satelite signals, it was a long 30-40 minutes writing all these numbers after charting them, and I found those I thought were zeros by simply waiting longer. I did a lot of checking on different tuners too, it all looks good I think. I finished near 12:45 AM. Note that for brevity, N/As were recorded as capital Xs. I did it mainly to maintain a log for future comparison if I think a problem exists ... but it was easy to copy / paste here. This is the order of appearance in the list.

32 total at 101º
1-8 96 96 95 52 94 95 95 96
9-16 94 96 94 0 95 96 95 96
17-24 95 77 95 60 95 96 95 95
25-32 95 69 95 0 95 96 95 95

16 from 99ca
1-8 X X X X X X X X
9-16 67 77 69 79 70 79 66 76
17-24 66 76 66 74 65 74 62 76
25-32 X X X X X X X X

14 from 99cb
1-8 83 83 77 82 78 79 77 82
9-16 76 82 76 82 84 83 X X
17-24 X X X X X X X X
25-32 X X X X X X X X

18 from 99s
1-8 76 81 51 82 92 89 95 80
9-16 X X X X X X 95 71
17-24 58 63 59 72 62 69 96 96
25-32 X X X X X X X X

10 from 103s
1-8 X X X X X X X X
9-16 X X X X X X 0 71
17-24 34 36 77 72 13 0 0 0
25-32 X X X X X X X X

24 from 103ca
1-8 57 62 54 56 55 58 51 56
9-16 65 64 64 60 60 62 56 62
17-24 57 56 50 60 59 55 52 53
25-32 X X X X X X X X

14 from 103cb
1-8 63 64 60 65 59 61 61 62
9-16 57 60 59 65 59 59 X X
17-24 X X X X X X X X
25-32 X X X X X X X X


They all are really clear. If I keep messing with it, I'm gonna need new bolts.;)
Property Building Window Plant Wood


That corner of the porch roof might still be partly blocking some signal, I'll aim to check it tomorrow with the sun.
 

· Mr. FixAnything
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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Yeah, it's look to me as the corner is really blocking signals. Perhaps better dish position could give you 4-5 %% more.
Good estimation of LOS is a line of arm's angle plus two times an angle from LNBF to a center of dish and dish's direction.https://www.satelliteguys.us/xen/attachments/lnb-offset-png.146685/
No doubt in my mind now, Thank You for the link too. As it stands now, I have to decide if I'm good trading some few percentage points for weather protection or not. I'll have to study it some. (y):)
 

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Why are you spending so much time with analysis and testing lol? Answer is obvious. The dish is positioned poorly under the roof. If trees can block the signal, you don't think a roof can? I'd just move the dish and move on with your life :). Not only would you get a better signal, you're also messing up your view by having an ugly dish on the railing to look at.
 

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Something was wrong!...It was me. I was not waiting long enough to see results, I thought I was just not getting anything in places. I thank you for your patience.

As a refresher, 11-03-2022 I moved my dish for the second time, this time lowering it a bit over a foot to maybe let it see satelites better out from under the porch roof overhang and then I did my best to peak it with TV on porch from basement reciever, using tones. I corrected skew too.

11-04-2022 at 12:01 AM I started testing all my satelite signals, it was a long 30-40 minutes writing all these numbers after charting them, and I found those I thought were zeros by simply waiting longer. I did a lot of checking on different tuners too, it all looks good I think. I finished near 12:45 AM. Note that for brevity, N/As were recorded as capital Xs. I did it mainly to maintain a log for future comparison if I think a problem exists ... but it was easy to copy / paste here. This is the order of appearance in the list.

32 total at 101º
1-8 96 96 95 52 94 95 95 96
9-16 94 96 94 0 95 96 95 96
17-24 95 77 95 60 95 96 95 95
25-32 95 69 95 0 95 96 95 95

16 from 99ca
1-8 X X X X X X X X
9-16 67 77 69 79 70 79 66 76
17-24 66 76 66 74 65 74 62 76
25-32 X X X X X X X X

14 from 99cb
1-8 83 83 77 82 78 79 77 82
9-16 76 82 76 82 84 83 X X
17-24 X X X X X X X X
25-32 X X X X X X X X

18 from 99s
1-8 76 81 51 82 92 89 95 80
9-16 X X X X X X 95 71
17-24 58 63 59 72 62 69 96 96
25-32 X X X X X X X X

10 from 103s
1-8 X X X X X X X X
9-16 X X X X X X 0 71
17-24 34 36 77 72 13 0 0 0
25-32 X X X X X X X X

24 from 103ca
1-8 57 62 54 56 55 58 51 56
9-16 65 64 64 60 60 62 56 62
17-24 57 56 50 60 59 55 52 53
25-32 X X X X X X X X

14 from 103cb
1-8 63 64 60 65 59 61 61 62
9-16 57 60 59 65 59 59 X X
17-24 X X X X X X X X
25-32 X X X X X X X X


They all are really clear. If I keep messing with it, I'm gonna need new bolts.;) View attachment 32604

That corner of the porch roof might still be partly blocking some signal, I'll aim to check it tomorrow with the sun.
I would move the dish to the 4x4 corner post below the porch. Attach a larger piece of hardwood or Azek to mount the dish to.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
It was there on that lower 6x6 corner, sticking out under the porch roof where hundred pound chunks of ice and snow often fall. I don't figure that would be so good come Christmas and the seasonal rerun of "White Christmas" or "The Wizard of Oz" ...

I guess I spent the time learning what I could. I've done my prior installs, I know I can put it out in the free air for better numbers, I know my metal roof will block signals but if you stood on the porch and looked towards 222 degrees, it's all clear. I've had dishes to mow around, I've had dishes needing to be swept of snow or cleaned of ice, I've had a dish under an eave protected with clear LOS and never needing cleaning off ... but I have some residual issues now so ladders hurt. This second move now in just a few days was slight, but it helped. Come Spring, I might move it again ... dropping it lower would easily do it. I might not even wait.
 

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It was there on that lower 6x6 corner, sticking out under the porch roof where hundred pound chunks of ice and snow often fall. I don't figure that would be so good come Christmas and the seasonal rerun of "White Christmas" or "The Wizard of Oz" ...

I guess I spent the time learning what I could. I've done my prior installs, I know I can put it out in the free air for better numbers, I know my metal roof will block signals but if you stood on the porch and looked towards 222 degrees, it's all clear. I've had dishes to mow around, I've had dishes needing to be swept of snow or cleaned of ice, I've had a dish under an eave protected with clear LOS and never needing cleaning off ... but I have some residual issues now so ladders hurt. This second move now in just a few days was slight, but it helped. Come Spring, I might move it again ... dropping it lower would easily do it. I might not even wait.
Why don't you just put it under the peak of the main roof in that pic? Then you don't have to look at it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 · (Edited)
I've figured out what I'm gonna do I think If I move it again, I'll remove the 2x6 there now, plug those few bolt holes, and build out on the back of the lowest log ends, set the dish out 6" more and lower it 14" by turning the pole 90 degrees and bolting to the back side of the low log ends, it'll be clear then.
 

· Mr. FixAnything
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I've figured out what I'm gonna do I think If I move it again, I'll removed the 2x6 there now, plug those few bolt holes, and build out on the back of the lowest log ends, set the dish out 6" more and lower it 14" by turning the pole 90 degrees and bolting to the back side of the low log ends, it'll be clear then.
Well, what about ice and snow fall to it ? :)
 

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It would be dangerous install - do it from very tall ladder alone...
I have my dish on the eave of a two story house and the initial installer didn't have a ladder long enough, so he just duct taped 2 ladders together (seriously). As they say, no guts, no glory. When I had to have the mount swapped to the newer under eave mount, I think they had a back up guy holding the ladder.

In OPs case, there's a window right there so just had a large buddy hold a cantilevered ladder out the window to serve as scaffolding lol 🤪 .

But still, I didn't want to look at my dish, so I had them stick it up there out of sight.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 · (Edited)
OK, I found a NIB 2" J-pole with two extra adjustable support braces, DirecTV ... open box ... it'll make for a cleaner looking mount and just in general, work better than this "S" pole will as I described in post 14. I'll have easier adjustability for plumbness too. It will easily get my dish outwards 6 or 8 more inches away from the railing so there'll be no roof corner maybe blocking it then, and I'll use the already mounted treated base I already have. It will get the dish a little more lower, further from the roof edge and just along the out side of the railing. It will also get that porch roof corner out of the way I think. I'll turn those 95-96s into 100s yet. :)

November 11, 2022....... Today as Nicole passes, been getting that 771 code a lot, wife said she'll be glad when I get the dish moved again. Waiting for the new mount now. :cool:

December 5, 2022:...... New mount came finally due to issues in seller's family, but now cold damp weather is messing with me. Only got that 771 when Nicole was going by, otherwise it's been great. (y)
 
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