[datavortex]

Greetings,

I am moving soon and I'm trying to decide exactly what I need to get for my new system. I'm a geek, but just getting into this stuff, so please bare with me as I fumble about.

I plan to have two receivers, one in my den and another in the bedroom. It's possible my roommate will also want a receiver in his room. For the den I want a PVR721, and for my bedroom I am planning to stick with the basic 301 model.

My first question is this: I want to purchase all of my equipment because I hate paying rental fees. However, it seems like every local installer just wants to rent me the equipment in exchange for upfront deals. Is there any way I can purchase my equipment, and still get the monthly rebate and free installation?

Secondly: I don't really understand the terminology about "DISH500", "DishPRO", and the different switches and things. What equipment am I going to need besides the two receivers? If I anticipate possibly adding a third receiver at some point, would it make sense to get a quad LNB now, and does this even make sense if I have "DishPRO"?

Thanks for your help!!

-- DV

 

[TNGTony]

Dish 500 is the name of the satellite dish that receives signal from two separate satellite locations at the same time. I'm pretty sure you'd have a hard time finding a package that DOESN'T come with a Dish 500.

DishPRO is a line of switches that is pretty new. In order for a receiver to see more than one satellite location at the same time you need a switch that the receiver controls seamlessly (ie you select the channel and the receiver figures out what switch to change and to what position). The DishPro line of switches and LNBs are supposed to be much simpler and easier to wire than the older standard switches. Now if you go with a Dish 500 that has a Quad LNB you really don't have to worry about any switches. They are built in to the housing of the LNB.

On the DBSTalk Home Page and on the EKB there are pages devoted to acronyms from the DBS industry.

I can't help you with purchase deals. though there may be other dealers/customers here that could point you in the right direction.

See ya
Tony

 

[datavortex]

Thanks very much for the wisdom Tony!

So, it sounds like for a complete install I need:
- PVR 721 receiver
- 301 receiver
- Dish 500
- Quad DishPro LNB

.. with the 721 using two leads from the LNB, and the 301 using one, leaving one to expand into later. Right??

So the Ebay hunt begins - which leads me to another question: What's the best way to distinguish between the legacy quad LNBs and the DishPro LNBs? Or would I just be better off eating the insane equipment cost and getting the free install?...

Thanks everyone for your help.

 

[TNGTony]

Yes. Be VERY careful buying from e-bay especially if you get a used receiver. Delinquent accounts and unpaid PPV purchases follow the receiver. IOW if you get a receiver that has an amount due, the account MUST be paid before the receiver can be activated for you.

I don't know enough about the DishPro line to be much help. There is a switch page on the EKB, but I fear it deals mostly with legacy stuff.

See ya
Tony

 

[Bill D]

Originally posted by datavortex
So the Ebay hunt begins - which leads me to another question: What's the best way to distinguish between the legacy quad LNBs and the DishPro LNBs? Or would I just be better off eating the insane equipment cost and getting the free install?...

Thanks everyone for your help.

If you are a new Dish customer, you are better off, buying from a dealer, they typically have great deals if you are a new sub, since they get commision on signing you up.
There are many out there on the internet and your normal brick and mortar type places.
I search for Dish net dealers will get you started.

I have used, dishdepot.com, and allsat.com in the past with no problems..'

 

[geneb11]

Like bill D said try these.I have seen them for $380 but not sure which site. Take advantage of being a new sub. http://www.dishdepot.com/Cart/items.php?CA=New+Subscribers&UID=
http://www.allsat.com/product.shtml

 

[datavortex]

That is extremely helpful, thanks again Tony, Bill and geneb11, your advice seems like the way to go.

So, it seems like the easiest way to avoid a lot of stress for myself if to just get the gear through a retailer and let them install it. (Rather than, "you want me to wire this bedroom for a receiver you got somewhere else?" difficulties).

All the online retailers I've seen suggested here look knowledgeable and the prices seem fair. The prices look to be pretty consistent across the board though, so unless I discover any appreciable price difference between my local retailers and the online dealers, it seems like buying from those doing the install it the way to go.

I talked to my roommate, and he wants a 301 in his bedroom too, so that will give me a 3-receiver setup, which I think would be appealing to anyone who gets a commission on me. Hope so.

Thanks again.

 

[Lightnin1]

Hello,

I am a retailer so let me take a crack at this.

First of all, there is no way you will get a rebate or free installation if you purchase your own equipment. Period.

If you purchase your stuff, just install it yourself. Nothing really to complicated. Just some basic knowledge. If you want a 2 receivers, and want one to be a 721, you will need either a quad LNBF, or 2 duals, and either a SW44 or SW64 switch. The difference between the two is the 44 has inputs for two birds, the 64 for three birds. Both have inputs to accomidate 4 receivers. The 721 requires 2 separate inputs because it has two separate tuners. It's like two receivers in on.

I can get you all the stuff "NEW" at a reasonable price. Plus some instruction on what to do.

Let me know

 

[John Corn]

I've dealt with Jason from Pro-Comm with no problems and he was very helpful. :righton:

 

[datavortex]

Originally posted by Pro-Com
First of all, there is no way you will get a rebate or free installation if you purchase your own equipment. Period.

That's too bad, but I guess understandable.

If you purchase your stuff, just install it yourself. Nothing really to complicated.

I'm just not too sure about this. I've never dropped cabling behind sheet rock before, nor positioned or aimed a satellite. I think line will have to be dropped into three separate rooms from the attic, and the dish mounted on a rooftop that's not flat. I'm confident in my technical ability, but not in my craftsmanship skills. I think I'd just be afraid that the dish would get blown off the roof and kill a kitten on the way down.

I can get you all the stuff "NEW" at a reasonable price. Plus some instruction on what to do.

Well, can't hurt to get the info at least. I've seen that people sell "install certificates" which seems like an odd way to handle the situation. But if I can get the hardware cheaper than from my local installers, I'm certainly interested.

What I'm interested in is pretty much what I outlined last:

• 1 PVR 721 receiver
• 2 301 receivers
• 1 Dish 500
• 1 Quad DishPro LNB
• The equipment to wire 3 rooms or pro install

As I understand it, with the new DishPro LNBs, I don't need any switches. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Thanks!

 

[Bill D]

Originally posted by Pro-Com
Hello,

I am a retailer so let me take a crack at this.

First of all, there is no way you will get a rebate or free installation if you purchase your own equipment. Period.
I can get you all the stuff "NEW" at a reasonable price. Plus some instruction on what to do.

Let me know

Correct me if I'm wrong and maybe you just don't work this way but there are deals out there for new subscribers compared to current subs buying the same equipment. Also not sure if this is the case but there are places in the past that would discount more if you did your own install.
One in particular last year I got my brother a new 4900 under the I like 9 promo, for $25 plus shipping and install kit (another $20). I did the install myself, and he got by far a great deal.. Granted this was a year ago
Bill

 

[Lightnin1]

Hello Bill,

there is nothing like this to my knowledge.

DataVortex,

here are your prices:
All prices are shipping included quotes


1 Dishpro 721 system $575.00 Note: This is a system. The dish 500 antenna IS included.

301 receiver $115.00 each

Dishpro quad $135.00

Once again, all prices are with shipping included. If you can give me some ballpark measurements, I can sell you the RG-6 cabling. Also wallplates, connectors, the whole 9 yards.

Visa, Mastercard, Discover

 

[datavortex]

Jason,

Unfortunately, it seems like these prices are not very competitive.

For instance, on one of the sites recommended above, allsat.com, I see that I can get my full setup, new, for right around $600 total. On their 721 product page, I can get a 721, a 301, a Dish500, and (I'll assume it's DishPro until they reply to my email) the quad LNB, with pro installation. The extra 301 receiver is $100, but that's an undiscounted price for existing subscribers that I hope to get cut a little (though there are very tempting used 301s on eBay for $30-$50, but obviously without installation).

It seems they offer such good pricing because of network incentives as alluded to by Bill. Quoting from their FAQ:

All retailers are "independent retailers," and therefore, the retailer is your only source for not paying Manufacture's Suggested Retail Prices (MSRP). DISH Network only sells at the MSRP. AllSat's prices are so unbelievably low because we purchase inventory in quantities that give us the largest discounts available. We also receive incentives for acquiring new customers; we apply a substantial portion of these incentives toward discounting the hardware so our customers can enjoy huge savings.

 

[Lightnin1]

All I can say is if you can get a 721 complete system for $489.90 you had better jump in feet first. I think you will find that there are alot of hidden costs, or that there not telling the full story. Even the 721 standalone that DBStalk.com is giving away is valued at $549.00 for the RECEIVER ONLY. If you need more info on this, I would check with one of the admins. That info right there should throw a big red flag up in your eyes. There selling a complete system for almost $100 under what my cost is. This is just another internet hack site. Please beware. Years in this business has yielded alot of knowledge and you should use very careful moves around these ripoffs. I think you will find to get the equipment at the cost there advertising, you will have to commit to a service agreement, which you have indicated you DO NOT WANT TO DO.

Be careful, please.

 

[Bill D]

Like I mentioned I have helped people setup there Dish equipment and know of atleast 5 people who have used allsat.com and have had no problems. they do make you committ to 8months of dish programming, but nothing else. Again this was a year ago that I last recommended a complete setup to someone. But that person was the 5th that I knew of.
I have also dealt with DishDepot, and they have excellent customer service, and are just a great bunch of people to deal with. Jason as someone else has mentioned you are also a very reputable dealer, but some customers do just want the best deal. I purchased my NHT speakers from a non authorized dealer and saved a couple hundred dollars.

I think what some of the internet places that do this is basically taking less profit per equipment sold, in hopes of getting more customers. I had heard that in the past some brick and mortar dealers have complained to Dish that every dealer (including internet) should be required to charge msrp or whatever price they set for a promo. Not sure of the exact details it was something I read here or at dbsforums.com
This is kind of wrong of Dish to tell someone what to charge in an open market system, if someone wants to take less profit for hopes of gaining more customers then that is their choice. Of course this may have been where sooo many on-line stores have gone wrong and went out of business.
In either way data vortex that is a great deal especially if it is a dishpro Quad, good luck..
Bill

 

[datavortex]

Jason,

Thanks for your concern. I appreciate your interest in seeing consumers not get screwed. It happens all too often online. You are certainly correct to assert that this hardware is being sold under MSRP and market value. I think it's understood that in order to get any promotional "New Subscriber" pricing, I will undoubtedly have to enter into a 12 month service contract.

I am willing to do this in order to secure the pricing benefits. I plan to maintain a qualifying programming package for longer than that anyway. I think the source of the misunderstanding is that I am not willing to pay equipment rental fees. It seems that retailers handle this one of two ways, by either giving you "free" equipment up front and then you pay the normal monthly fee, or charging for the equipment and giving you a monthly ($17 or so) discount off your bill (as how accounts established directly are handled in the current promo).

So, that's about a $200 new customer incentive, the kickback for the retailers seems to be closer to the $300 mark per new 12 month contract. I imagine this is where the price differences we're seeing originate.

So, I will take a service contract. Does this affect your pricing? Can you do the whole package, installed, for less than $700?

Thanks again.

 

[keitheva]

DV, i think you should consider rental. i just got the dish digital home plan installed for $50. this includes everything in your list except its a PVR508 instead of a 721. rental is $5 per receiver per month - so for you this would be $15 pm. if your cost to buy and install is $700, @ $15pm, $700 would pay for nearly 4 years of rental!

 

[datavortex]

keitheva,

That's certainly something to think about. I think that you're correct in your thinking that most people who get service would be better off renting for the reasons you specify.

I am stuck on the idea of owning my own, however, for a couple reasons. The first is ideological and intangible (read: maybe a little stupid) - I just like owning my own stuff. For the same reason I hate being in debt, renting a home, or leasing a car, I really hate having corporate-owned stuff in my home. But that's just me being paranoid.

The more significant reason is that I've yet to see a lease plan that offered a 721, and I'm quite stuck on the idea of getting one of these nifty units. In fact, this piece of hardware is one of the primary reasons I want to use Dish Network at all. My support of this appliance is also somewhat ideological, besides its great features, sleek interface, and expandability, I also really like the 721 because it's a Linux machine. I will always support manufacturers who use Linux, and I'm willing to spend a little more to do it.

Thanks for your analysis, though. Your numbers are right on.

 

[Guest]

Is the 6000 rentable or do you have to buy it? I've been looking into getting one (I have nothing right now) and haven't had anyone mention renting the equip.

Who rents it? Where can I look for info on this?

Thanks,
Jim

 

[HTguy]

The E* leasing deal is called "The Digital Home Plan." It's actually a good deal for multiple receiver households because the subscriber only pays $5/month more than he would if he owned the eqmt and he doesn't have to lay out many hundreds of $s "upfront" plus he has a service agreement for the life of the subscription. The certificates that various websites & mass-merchandisers like Sears sell for $49.99 is for this deal.

But the PVR721 is not an option on this deal (the PVR508 is for an extra $50 up front) and neither is the Model 6000. If you want to have a PVR 721 or a Model 6000 you will have to purchase them.

But there is a rebate deal for people who buy their eqmt. It's called "FREE FOR ALL." The cust gets $50 off the 2nd rcvr and 12 monthly credits of $17 for a total of $204 back. A free basic professional installation is included.

And the installation, plus good tech support & service down the road, is why you should find an experienced professional local full-service retailer. If you buy online or at a mass-merchandiser you may get another "certificate" for a free install but the fulfillment companies & their subcontractors that do the work are pretty poor overall and notoriously bad in Georgia.

I would recommend you ask your friends & neighbors for a recommendation for a local knowledgeable full-service pro or check the dealer locater services on the E* website or http://www.dumpcable.com .