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NHL:Forsberg best all around player?

1090 Views 15 Replies 3 Participants Last post by  Unthinkable
There are tons of players in this league, who many would consider to be the best, however when you account for all components of excellence in all aspects of the game, Peter Forsberg stands alone. He is an expectional offensive and extraordinary defensive player. He came back from a possible career ending injury and reached a level of excellence perhaps superior to that of his game before the injury occured. He, as all players as flaws, although these are minor and his pros overshadow these flaws. Offense is an obvious as he has had numerous seasons with substantial point totals. As well, his defense ability is precise, effecient and productive. He is an intelligent player on and off the ice and deserves to don the title of best overall player in the league. Peace in.
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Agreed on all counts above. He's the kind of guy who makes everyone around him take their game to new levels as well.
Too bad he is a Euro though. Love his style of play. I see WAY too much of him here in Phoenix, usually kicking our asses. :(
I probably don't know the game of hockey as good as most of you, but this is my take on Forsberg.

The guy is a top notch player, but he's always been way overrated. People say they wouldn't trade him straight up for Lindros, but he's just as injury prone, if not more. He's fragile, sometimes he goes through dry spells and he's NEVER scored more than 30 goals a season playing on the Avalanche. I'm not saying he's not a great hockey player, but I would say that he's not in the top five right now.
I think Drury would probably say he owes a lot of his game today to playing with the likes of Forsberg and Sakic. Calgary has a lot to be psyched about now with him and Iginla on the same team minus Morris. I watched Forsberg throw a great hit yesterday only to later pull back when the same Ducks player stood up and cornered him with the threat of a possible face wash or punch to the face inciting a possible penalty following it. He's one well disciplined player by all means and his importance to the Avalanche is very well established throughout the league. I couldn't believe how well he approached the playoffs after his serious injury which sidelined him through all of last years regular season.

Eric Lindros almost died from one of his serious Flyer injuries a few years back. He was laying in a hotel bathtub one night before one of his teammates discovered him (believe it was Keith Jones at the time) in the worst pain imaginable and immediately realized his life was in jeapordy. Had he been on a plane it could have been really ugly... I give him all the credit in the world for toning down his game from his earlier years where he used to try and put his opponents through the boards and into section 6 on every other shift from game to game. All those concussions and the the premature retirement of his brother Brett has forced him to play a smarter game where he takes his own health a bit more seriously today.

Getting back to Forsberg though, it was a true throwback to the game similarly watching Lemieux comeback from his Hodgkins disease so effectively and from all of his numerous back problems. Witnessing Saku Koivu spring back to such excellent form last year in the playoffs and at the tail end of the season after all the chemo treatments was pretty sensational as well. It's amazing how humble pro hockey players can be after the elite score 4 or 5 goals in a game and contribute with fights and assists as well. Reminded me of when Ron Tugnutt with the Nordiques made 70+ saves in one night against the Bruins so many years back. I don't see much of that in the other pro sports so thats one huge reason why I love the NHL so much.
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Noooo, James, is that the Dell dude? :rolleyes:
At least it isn't BB.

Unthinkable, I need tips on who to watch on the Center Ice,
Teams and players, when you see good games and matchups let me know........you guys are teaching me hockey this year!! :)
Originally posted by John Corn
Unthinkable, I need tips on who to watch on the Center Ice,
Teams and players, when you see good games and matchups let me know........you guys are teaching me hockey this year!! :)
As a general rule, look forward to watching the continuing matchups from last seasons playoffs where good teams were bounced out and are looking for serious retribution...

Boston vs. Montreal, New York Islanders vs. Toronto Maple Leafs, Vancouver vs. Detroit, Philly vs Ottawa, New Jersey vs. Carolina, Colorado vs. LA, San Jose vs. Phoenix, Saint Louis vs Chicago etc...

*How about the certifiable five star nutty profanity laced tirade that Brian Burke pulled after game 3 in the Vancouver Detroit playoff series?

"Todd Bertuzzi does not play for Detroit. It just looks like that because he's wearing two or three red sweaters all the time."

"I didn't know that tackling was an acceptable tactic. I didn't see it in the rule book."

"Sedin is not English for punch me or headlock me in a scrum."

"Our goalie is the goaltender on the ice who does not dive when he gets brushed."

Definately one series worth watching this season after all the anger in the playoffs. Lots and lots of bad blood still there between Toronto and the New York Islanders as well after Peca was knocked out of the series and several Leafs players were KO'd. Those two teams hate one another. Devils vs. Rangers should be awesome this year with Holik now a Ranger.

Anytime you see the following matchups you can usually count on a pretty worthwhile and intense game as well:

Detroit vs. Colorado / San Jose / Los Angeles / Vancouver

Dallas vs. Detroit / San Jose / Phoenix / Saint Louis

Boston vs. Montreal / Detroit / Toronto / New Jersey (Pat Burns now with NJ against Robbie Ftorek who was a Devils coach. Burns once commented that "coaching the bruins is like bear hunting with a butterknife")

I still get excited seeing original six teams play against one another even though the old rivalries aren't anywhere near as intense as they used to be. Toronto, Montreal, Detroit, Chicago, Boston, and the New York Rangers are the original six teams in the NHL with the most storied histories. Boston and Montreal still have a great rivalry today. Toronto and Montreal is generally good to go as well. Chicago and Detroit is "ok" to a much lesser degree then the others with the Hawks having been so bad over the last decade, but they had a good season last year which surprised a lot of people considering their roster. I was shocked when Chelios defected to his teams biggest rival which was Detroit years ago, but its no longer a big story anymore.

I will try and hit on some of the better players to watch this season in another thread.
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Unthinkable, Great Post.......Thanx a million!! :righton:
NHL players worth keeping an eye on this season for all different reasons:

Anaheim: McDonald, Kariya-pride of U. Maine, Rucchin-way underrated still today, Sykora who was great in Jersey with Holik and Elias on a crash line that could score and bang, Adam Oates- still one of the best passers and faceoff artists in the league like J. Nieuwendyk once was, Salei for the occasional big hits which can be controversial against the better stars in the league, maybe even S. Pahlsson if called up as this is likely his final boarding call with the Ducks.

Atlanta: Kozlov, super rookie sensations Heatley and Kovalchuk who were arguably the two brightest rising stars last season in the NHL, McEachern who was unreal in Boston and Ottawa in terms of pure goal scoring coming off of a bad season with a new team now, Stefan still looking to prove his critics wrong and avoid more concussions which could end his career early, Tamer for the occasional good scraps when the team needs a boost from their enforcer and Odgers isn't cutting it.

Boston: Thornton-newly captained and one of the brightest young stars in the league today like Marleau and Lecavalier, Samsonov-ditto Joe Thornton's skills and appetite only Sergei is one of the most amazing skaters in the NHL with a knack for scoring beautiful goals after skating like a water bug, Murray-no one ever would have figured 41 goals last season like Guerin did, Rolston-one of the most valuable players Bruins have, great at the point on the Power Play, great on the Penalty Kill, Even Strength you name it, Huml-looking good as a rookie, Girard-now has confidence he didnt have before and is playing like it, Berard who had the cornea of one of his eyes sliced open and is now mostly blind on one side by a M. Hossa high stick windup a few years back which left him kicking his skates into the ice holding his face in one of the ugliest misfortunate happenings I've ever seen, Boynton-one of B's best/most solid defenseman now, PJ Stock-hasn't fought yet, but he wont back down from anyone despite giving up a lot of size every night, Lapointe-way overpaid imho, but a good leader and good team player, G Tim Thomas-his parents once sold their wedding rings for $$$ to get him into a hockey competition as a kid. Hilbert and Herr when called up, Stumpel as a great playmaker/finesse passer who doesn't shoot enough and earned the appropriate label of ultimate "playoff bust" last year against Montreal -reputation for being easily taken out of the play and off pucks with any degree of physical play used against him.

Buffalo: Satan who is always worth watching closely, Connolly and Pyatt both looking like they are ready for true breakout years, Brown who is way underrated and a great hustler, Barnes who was super solid in Florida years ago, Gratton now looking reborn after a lot of trades around the league early in his career left his skeptics laughing to no end over his failure to live up to the potential he has, Hecht, Afinogenov when he returns- a young Samsonov in the making, JP Dumont who the Sabres fleeced Chicago out of in a Gilmour deal, Ray with the bare knuckles, Varada's big hits, McKee, Zhitnik, Wooley who had a brilliant hip check against Markov the other night before Langkow stepped in and challenged him to a fight, Patrick, Biron who is a really really good to great netminder in the making and who could help Buffalo fans get over D. Hasek pretty quickly.

Calgary: Iginla-unbelievable player, Drury-ditto Iginla, Gelinas, Conroy, Yelle, Berube, Turek. Small market Canadian dollars always a big factor in hurting this teams post season playoff chances.

Carolina: O'Neill who is one of my favorites for grit, heart, hustle, determination all out amazing play, Bataglia also really scrappy player who can hustle to no end, Brindamour and Francis still good as they age, Erik Cole-excellent rookie year last season, Hedican, Kapanen who is always worth watching, Hill can throw some big punishing hits from time to time, Vasicek, Kevyn Adams great on faceoffs, Tanabe, Wallin, Weekes had a career defining playoff series against NJ last season where he had never before played at that high of a level. Looks like he bumped Irbe out of the number one position and he looks prepared to hang onto his newfound status.
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Chicago: Zhamnov, Berezin who had his number of critics in Toronto but still has his share of skills, Sullivan who the Chicago GM claimed two years ago was the no brainer better player between him and Boston's Nick Boynton, Calder, Odelein, Mironov.

Colorado: Forsberg, Sakic, Blake, Roy who once told Jeremy Roenick that he couldn't hear him because he had two stanley cups firmly lodged in both his ears after Roenick attempted to discount his skills a bit in the media saying something about Roy having been lit up so badly that he had to go find his jockstrap in the stands or something to that effect, Vrbata, Foote, Hejduk, Morris who was coveted by every team in the NHL and recently traded for Drury. This team has arguably more depth then everyone else save for maybe San Jose, Dallas, and Detroit.

Columbus: Nash, Knutsen, Cassels, Sillinger, Sanderson who was a great Hartford Whaler back in the day before the team moved to Carolina, Whitney, Dineen also a famous Hartford Whaler who had a knack years ago for scoring big goals late in games, Jean Luc Grand Pierre, Lachance, Denis, Klesla, Richardson.

Dallas: Bill Guerin, Mike Modano, Zubov and Sydor getting older but two rather great offensive defensemen paired together in their time that most other teams dreamed of having someday, Turgeon, Morrow, Young, DiMaio who is looking completely reborn and is determined to be an impact player this season (real small but never afraid to mix it up with anyone- scrappy as all hell like NJ's Mike Danton), Malhotra, Arnott who was big in NJ, Downey who fought everyone as a Providence Bruin and has the trademark breathe rite strip over his nose, Hatcher, Matvichuk, Muller, Tugnutt, Turco. So much depth here its unreal what $$$ can buy. Team will be sold to a new owner as the current one is more interested in shaping his major league baseball team. Should be a real contender this year in the vein of a Colorado, San Jose, Detroit.

Detroit: hardly a bad player on the team really. Won the Stanley Cup for good reason. New coach in town and Yzerman still on the mend-one of the classiest captains the NHL has ever been graced with, Hasek out and Curtis Joseph in with a lot of folks in Toronto howling over the loss of Cujo. Datsuyk is supposed to be huge someday, Fedorov once had such an amazing game years ago that the Detroit News I believe had a headline reading something like: Fedorov 5, Flames 0 (Insert whichever team he defeated single handedly), Robitaille, Shanahan one of the funniest practical joke players in the league with great skills as well, Maltby, Hull, Chelios, Fischer, Lidstrom who many consider to be tops in defensemen overall every year.
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Edmonton: Anson Carter who has done great things on and off the ice in his short career for black fans and street hockey players everywhere, York, Comrie, Ninimaa, Smyth who is coveted league wide, Moreau, Marchant who has a reputation for being a big hitter, Dopita, Laraque who can fight and score a bit like Brashear, Salo who is a great great goaltender who never gets the press like others get since he's buried on a small market Edmonton team.

Florida: Mike Keenan in town as coach which means if you have no size at all (read Valeri Bure) he has little use for you and if your last name is Matteau he will trade for you even when you are dead and buried after what he did to help the Rangers win the cup years ago, Kozlov, Huselius who is poised to be a star someday, Ozolinsh who is your prototypical offensive defenseman, V. Bure who will likely be dealt and dealt soon, Bouwmeester who is a top ten draft pick with tons and tons of potential to be the star player that Chris Pronger became once under Iron Mike Keenan, Luongo who the Islanders dealt away quickly like they did with a lot of their potential franchise netminders.

Los Angeles: Jason Allison, Adam Deadmarsh, Rasmussen known for great hustle in his Buffalo days, Smolinski who has a lot to prove after last year, Laperriere, Frolov who many feel could be the Calder winner -best rookie this year, Palffy when he's not injured!, Visnovsky, Norstrom, Potvin.

Minnesota: Brunette and Gaborik, former Bruins castaways Antii Laaksonen and Wes Walz - one of my best friends in high school once dropped everything he had to run off and buy a bruins pen so that he could get this guys autograph on his Walz jersey at the old Boston Garden on a night when he was not playing and seen walking through the concourse, Ronning, Zholtok another Bruins castaway, Fernandez, Roloson who was expendable in Buffalo behind Hasek and Biron.

Montreal: Saku Koivu who was the feel good story of the year last season coming back from cancer and doing it in grand fashion leading his team with outstanding courage and heart. Boston's gigantic green giant defenseman Hal Gill who almost opted to play pro football instead of hockey smashed Koivu into the teams bench in the playoffs and Koivu retaliated with both hits and goals on the scoreboard where it mattered more. I wrote Saku a quick note of encouragement the moment I heard he had cancer telling him I couldn't wait to see him back in his jersey leading his team to victory and he promptly wrote back to me with a signed picture and a very heartfelt thank you which I look at anytime I'm feeling a bit down, Juneau who is also a big Bruins killer since he was dealt away-Bruins GM Harry Sinden once told the Boston papers that "Juneau had better practice his yodeling" when he threatened to holdout and folks figured he would wind up playing overseas in Switzerland, Perreault who I got to see play for the Phoenix Roadrunners when I lived in Arizona and has become a solid player, Zednick, Dackell, Czerkawski another Bruin who was dealt away for being "too soft" in the giving/taking hits dept, Kilger, McKay who was a great NJ Devil, Quintal, Lindsay, and one of the best young netminders in the league today bar none: Jose Theodore.
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Nashville: Johansson, Legwand, Delmore, Timonen, Hulse, Mike Dunham who played awesome behind Marty Brodeur in New Jersey. Predators management did something this year that I haven't seen many other NHL teams do before which was to tell its season ticketholders that if they miss the playoffs this season they will get some kind of partial refunds. The push is on for them to actually make the playoffs this year despite fielding a gritty team without many true nhl stars headlining this roster.

New Jersey: Elias who is way valuable to this team, Friesen who has awesome speed and did great things in San Jose, Brylin who is way underrated and a great russian player, Gomez who is a super player with usually strong production consistency, Mad Dog John Madden who is a strong defensive specialist that can score from time to time, Nieuwendyk known for being one of the best faceoff artists in the league and who used to be great in Dallas, Tverdovsky who has great offensive skills on the blue line, Danton who gave the Rangers absolute fits in the preseason despite being rather small/short by nhl standards, Rafalski who is underrated in my opinion, Stevens with huge hits like the one he planted on a Flyer not long ago which makes every NHL Cool Shots highlight hits video- known for dealing Lindros and Welcome to the NHL Shane Willis concussions, Stevenson, Zyuzin, Langenbrunner who needs to get it going much like Nieuwendyk does, Niedermayer, Pandolfo, Daneyko, and one of my favorite big game clutch netminders/movie lover extraordinaire: Martin Brodeur.

New York Islanders: Isbister is wanted by most every team in the league and you can see why pretty easily, Bates, Parrish, Torres, Yashin, Peca once he comes back from his serious injury, Scratchard, Hamrlik, the always worth watching closely Aucoin, Cairns, Kvasha, Osgood, Snow who left a huge impression on me after the Brashear/McSorley high stick incident when he skated down the length of the ice to take on Bruins then goalie Byron Dafoe showing all kinds of heart and dedication to his teammates.

New York Rangers: The joke of the league the past few seasons for spending so unwisely and so halphazardly with the kinds of wreckless abandon that makes guys like Harry Sinden cringe to no end. Holik and Kasparaitis are the big stories in Manhattan this year with Bure, Lindros, Messier, Poti, Leetch, Nedved, and countless others all being great nhlers. Jamie Lundmark had a brilliant preseason with many serious Rangers fans pencilling him in as a serious impact player this season, Richter and Blackburn in nets. Defenseman Tom Poti was heavily coveted at the trade deadline last year for his offensive skills when he was dealt by Edmonton and he still has a lot to prove. Can this team do it is the big question here. Team chemistry?
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Ottawa: Always way dominant in the regular season, but usually a first round punchout once the playoffs start as the team always comes up short on grit and size. Alfredsson big on points, Wedden with a good plus minus, Hossa and Bonk strong players, Chara, Havlat, Leschyshyn, Phillips, Schaefer should be a great player someday considering who he was traded for, Arverdson, Lalime a pretty solid netminder who once set a brilliant consecutive win streak in Pittsburgh with a great rookie season. Team has to prove they can survive a more physical playoff grind this year although obstruction rules changes should play in their favor.

Philadelphia: New boss in town and its Ken Hitchcock who has a no-nonsense taskmaster approach to the game of hockey which many fans figured wouldn't mesh well at all with guys like the usually free spirited Jeremy Roenick. Many speculated that Roenick wouldn't have signed with Philly had he known Hitchcock would someday be his coach, but he downplayed it to no end last week on NHL Cool Shots saying he's willing to do whatever his coach asks of him to get his shot at winning the Stanley Cup no matter what roles or icetimes are part of said sacrifices. Hitchcock was able to convince Brett Hull of all players to play defense so things should be rather fascinating to watch this year in Philly. Leclair looking to bounce back with a hopefully better stronger back, Weinrich strong on D, Recchi always a force, Desjardins, Brashear still unfortunately looking to shed his rep as a heavyweight fighter who once upon a time couldn't score to save his life in a brothel- hopefully he has discontinued his habits from old days where he would dust off his hands in mocking fashion after winning big fights which would only serve to further infuriate his opponents, Fedoruk, Handzus, Primeau, Brendl who was a Rangers bust, Esche, Cechmanek, and my favorite Flyer today Simon Gagne who has been mister consistency with awesome production. He is a model player for every young nhler to pattern themselves after in my opinion. Gagne and Gomez have both been neck and neck over the past few seasons in putting up the kinds of numbers that agents fantasize over since so many younger players have problems attaining this degree of consistency.

Phoenix: Amonte, Langkow, Markov, Briere, Numminen, C. Lemieux, Doan, Wilson, Burke, Boucher, and Nazarov for the soul reason that I don't believe he ever won a single fight when he played for the Bruins even though he never backed down from anyone that I can recall and always had a trademark bear hug which would turn every potential fight into the inevitable going nowhere fast wrestling match. Gretzky as owner with a strong committed vision of fielding a contending team here with the same go all out enthusiasm he had as a player, Paul Coffey now running special teams there should help a lot along with a really smart defensive coach who many felt was jobbed last year for coach of the year awards. Burns had him as his top assistant coach and he was priceless in Boston. Flyers fans like to joke that Phoenix was absolutely rooked with the Boucher deal, but time will tell.

Pittsburgh: Mario, Mario, and Mario! Number 66 should benefit from the rules changes the most of all nhlers this season as it now looks like his strong criticism for the league becoming a clutch and hold fest didn't fall on deaf ears after all many years ago when he retired early. Kovalev is absolutely unbelievable in so many different ways at once, Robitaille has to put up or shut up as he led the AHL in points with the Providence Bruins years ago and still has yet to establish himself as a true impact player that deserves the big minutes of ice time, Morozov, Hrdna, Laukkanen, Manderville, Aubin, and Martin Straka should be his usual self once he returns from yet another serious/crazy off ice injury dropping weights on himself. Alexandre Daigle you will notice will be booed at every Canadian hockey rink he skates in as he was a super bust in Ottawa and most Canadians felt he has all the skills in the world but a ten cent head with no desires to play the game with any passion or emotion at all. Daigle went hollywood after he left the NHL pursuing an acting career which never panned out so this year he had tryout agreements with a few teams hoping to convince them he had a renewed commitment to a sport he could be really great at with the right attitude.

San Jose: Really deep talented lineup which a lot of hockey experts figure could go all the way to the Cup this year. Easier to say which players not to watch then to list the ones to watch as there are few bad players on this team- perhaps a handful of underachievers though. Marleau had the best playoff production of any hockey player i can remember in recent years and is a sensational talent on the rise still- he was picked #2 right after Boston took Joe Thornton number one in 97 I believe, Sturm is good to go. Nolan once called the corner his shot would score in before he did it in an all star game which was impressive to no end. Selanne had 76 goals his rookie season and will never hit that again, but will still always be a deadly sharpshooter most teams would die to have, Teams big netminder Nabokov was just recently signed so things should change for the better in a big hurry here. Marchment has a reputation for being a rather dirty player in the NHL still today.
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St Louis: Crushing crushing blow for fans of the Blues recently witnessing Pronger having yet another surgery on his hand after things weren't responding at all to his rehabbed expectations. Watch for Weight who had a really bad season last year to bounce back to his form in his Oilers days when he fed Guerin goals all night long, losing Scott Young to Dallas hurt a lot like the B's losing Guerin to them, Stillman, Ktachuk, MacInnis, Demitra even with a concussion prone head, Drake, Mayers, Eastwood, Jackman is one to watch in a big big way for his tougness alone and heart as well.

Tampa Bay: This is now Lecavalier's team and one that is much improved from years past when Vincent requested a trade and a new lease on life under previous regimes. The Tampa Bay GM unfairly put all the weight of the world on his shoulders on draft day giving him the kind of comparison lofty label that I thought was really quite premature for a kid to have to live up to before he's even adjusted to an 82 game season with life on the road. Martin St. Louis looking really good this year, Prospal improving on last season like I figured he would, watch for Fedotenko, Clymer, Kubina, Andreychuk, Taylor, and Richards as well. Khabibulin just HUGE in goal for the Lightning after his prolonged holdout in Phoenix. This could very well be the year that Tampa actually makes the playoffs no matter how funny that would seem in other years.

Toronto: Pat Quin still in charge up there driving Islanders players and fans mad with insanity among others. Mogilny looking really good so far, Sundin is always a horse for them, Kaberle looking pretty solid right now along with Darcy Tucker (I think Tampa fans are still screaming at him that he's a punk), Svehla, Reichel, Corson, Domi, Renberg, McCabe, Belfour who once trashed a hotel room when he played for Dallas and tried to bribe the arresting cop with "billions of billions of dollars" LOL! in a drunk stupor.

Vancouver: Nasland, Morrison, Jovanovski aka JovoCop, Bertuzzi, both the Sedin's, Warriner, Salo, F. Fedorov, Baron, Linden. I don't think this team will sit put with its current goaltenders - look for them to bring in a certifiable number one netminder like a Byron Dafoe who is currently sitting at home without a team.

Washington: Jagr and Lang together again the way it should be. Lang is way underrated in the NHL. Jagr the past few seasons hasn't been pushing himself to be the player he can be and has been guilty of not having the mental part of his game in focus so he has something to prove to a lot of folks this season. In Pittsburgh he made an off the cuff remark to reporters one year that he felt like he was "dying alive" out there without ever explaining what was truly bothering him to no end and giving his owner Mario Lemieux fits. Mario had to coddle him like a baby and beg for him to play harder and not tune out his coaches instructing his teammates to follow his lead and not the lead of the Czech coach there before it finally came time for him to be shipped out of PA. Gonchar is a superb talent as is Bondra. Peat has earned a rep for being one of the toughest fighters in the NHL today and Simon is no slouch either even with the bad boy long hair all cut off. Watch Konowalchuk, Witt, and Kolzig as well.
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:eek: .............Wow!!!
Thanx Unthinkable :righton:

It appears I can watch the Blue Jackets on Center Ice, there blacking out the Pittsburgh games. :)
Intresting, its pretty much about the same distance to either city, roughly 100 miles.

I watched the Blue Jackets and Tampa last night. :righton:
Heard Jason Spezza was recalled up in Ottawa so I'll be watching him pretty closely to see if he's the prized pick of the draft that many people believe he was. Ottawa, New Jersey, and San Jose have all been tops in scouting/drafting players that actually make the difficult transition to the NHL game so chances are probably slightly better for Spezza making it as an impact player someday after all the big name players the Sens have been able to break in.

One other reason to watch the B's vs. Sens game tonight will be that its opening night at the FleetCenter and Terry O'Reilly will have his jersey retired in what I'm sure will be a moving ceremony.
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