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AllStar
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51 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi,
Thanks to all for the hints on a good install for my AT9 dish.
Installers were great did everything I asked and answered
all my questions. Only ran into one problem which they could
not fix with what they had on their truck so I figured the good
folks here could maybe answer it.

I have one of those Winegard OTA HD antennas that DirecTV
use to install back in the day with was powered by a spilter
into the multiswitch. Well since the new HD feeds do not let
you put the OTA through the switch I'm without OTA HD which
sucks as CW isn't on my local D*TV HD feed. We tried using the
old multiswitch and just passing the OTA through but that ended
up crashing the new multiswitch and blocked it from working.

So good folks how do I fix this? I've got the cable ran from the
Winegard to the reciever but need to power it to get some signal.

Thanks in advance! Also I did take photos of my signal strength
before the install if anyone is curious I can post before and after
shots. - Will
 

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Cool Member
Joined
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19 Posts
FLSHADOW said:
Hi,
Thanks to all for the hints on a good install for my AT9 dish.
Installers were great did everything I asked and answered
all my questions. Only ran into one problem which they could
not fix with what they had on their truck so I figured the good
folks here could maybe answer it.

I have one of those Winegard OTA HD antennas that DirecTV
use to install back in the day with was powered by a spilter
into the multiswitch. Well since the new HD feeds do not let
you put the OTA through the switch I'm without OTA HD which
sucks as CW isn't on my local D*TV HD feed. We tried using the
old multiswitch and just passing the OTA through but that ended
up crashing the new multiswitch and blocked it from working.

So good folks how do I fix this? I've got the cable ran from the
Winegard to the reciever but need to power it to get some signal.

Thanks in advance! Also I did take photos of my signal strength
before the install if anyone is curious I can post before and after
shots. - Will
I'm still using my triple LNB and running an OTA through my mutiswitch. (Not the MS at the sat antenna, but a standalone.) My market is fat with HD and so I'm taking all my local HD OTA from a standalone, unpowered TERK running direct to my MSwitch. I've got a HR20, still viewing only mpeg2 HD and waiting for the OTA tuner to be turned up. Before I switch to the 5LNB, I'd like some explanation from someone who's experienced it as to what's all this about the MPEG 4 feeds either not running though a standard multiswitch or diplexer or not plexing at all with an OTA signal. Can you help me out on this one?
 

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Registered
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12,583 Posts
manny1 said:
.... Before I switch to the 5LNB, I'd like some explanation from someone who's experienced it as to what's all this about the MPEG 4 feeds either not running though a standard multiswitch or diplexer or not plexing at all with an OTA signal. Can you help me out on this one?
I'll take a stab ....
The AT9 Ka/Ku 5-LNB dish uses a much wider range of frequencies on its coax outputs than the older single or triple LNB dishes. This is to accomodate the added Ka-band (99-deg and 103-deg) satellite signals (currently your MPEG4 HD Locals and Regional Sports Net HD channel). Because of these wider frequencies, you need a multiswitch that can handle them .... the Zinwell WB68 or WB616 being the currently recommendations. Also because of these wider frequencies you cannot diplex OTA or cable TV signals on the same cables anymore because those frequencies overlap with the wider Ka-band requirements.

Bottom line .... if you plan to eventually upgrade to MPEG4 HDTV with the Ka/Ku AT9 dish, run a dedicated coax for your OTA antenna feed.
 

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AllStar
Joined
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51 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I ran a line direct from the Winegard to the receiver but was not
getting anything but one channel. I do have the AT9 5 LNB dish
installed and Zinwell multiswitch. My question is how do I get power
to the Winegard OTA antenna when I can't use the old multiswitch
or the new one? The installer suggest a dual sided power duplexer
but I have zero clue where to find that. I appreciate the answers so
far. - Thanks - Will
 

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Cool Member
Joined
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19 Posts
litzdog911 said:
I'll take a stab ....
The AT9 Ka/Ku 5-LNB dish uses a much wider range of frequencies on its coax outputs than the older single or triple LNB dishes. This is to accomodate the added Ka-band (99-deg and 103-deg) satellite signals (currently your MPEG4 HD Locals and Regional Sports Net HD channel). Because of these wider frequencies, you need a multiswitch that can handle them .... the Zinwell WB68 or WB616 being the currently recommendations. Also because of these wider frequencies you cannot diplex OTA or cable TV signals on the same cables anymore because those frequencies overlap with the wider Ka-band requirements.

Bottom line .... if you plan to eventually upgrade to MPEG4 HDTV with the Ka/Ku AT9 dish, run a dedicated coax for your OTA antenna feed.
Thanks! Question is however, as D* adds "nationals" to their HD lineup, are they going to add them to the new KA birds or to the exsisting KU transponders. I've got a fairly big investment in current mpeg2 boxes and would REALLY dislike having to run a separate line for OTA to each.
 

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Cutting Edge: ECHELON '07
Joined
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9,809 Posts
manny1 said:
Thanks! Question is however, as D* adds "nationals" to their HD lineup, are they going to add them to the new KA birds or to the exsisting KU transponders. I've got a fairly big investment in current mpeg2 boxes and would REALLY dislike having to run a separate line for OTA to each.
ALL new HD will be in MPEG4 on the new KA sats. All current MPEG2 HD will be converted to MPEG4 and moved to the KA sats. This will all happen in the next year to year and a half. It's the whole reason for the KA sats.
 

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Cutting Edge: ECHELON '07
Joined
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9,809 Posts
FLSHADOW said:
My question is how do I get power
to the Winegard OTA antenna when I can't use the old multiswitch
or the new one? The installer suggest a dual sided power duplexer
but I have zero clue where to find that. I appreciate the answers so
far. - Thanks - Will
Sounds like you need an old style amplifier/power booster like I have. Any local TV electronics shop should have one. Just find a place that sells OTA antennas and ask for one.
 

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Godfather
Joined
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253 Posts
I've had my AT-9 dish for about 2 months with the install of the H20, now I also have an HR20 as well. I live in fringe area for the Denver D* market so I am able to get the Denver HD Mpeg-4 stations. I also have an antenna to watch Colorado Springs OTA HD stations. The first installer for the AT-9 could not believe I did not have a multiswitch and DID NOT provide one either. I bought my own Terk 5-8 from Best Buy and installed with the OTA running through the multiswitch then "di-plexing" (high frequency pass splitter) to the OTA input. The OTA works fine on my HR10-250 and H20 (no matter what I do will not work on my HR-20 wink wink :) ). All the HDs (local Denver), national CBS LA, ABC LA, FOX LA and OTA HD Colorado Springs work great. I also feed the terk the 12v from the wall wart (transformer) as well.
 

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Beware the Attack Basset
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24,428 Posts
FLSHADOW said:
I ran a line direct from the Winegard to the receiver but was not getting anything but one channel.
Can you separate the Winegard from the amplifier? If not, you could run an 18VDC (or whatever the amp is rated at) power inserter above where you split the leads to go to your various TVs/receivers and that should keep the amplifier happy.

I have a theory that national content will stay on the Ku birds due to their wider coverage. Ka beams are generally narrower and more succeptible to fade.

As for your hefty investment, that's why they've been discouraging purchased hardware for a while now.
 

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Registered
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5,652 Posts
OK, a few points of explanation.
When the next satellites are launched, DirecTV 10 and 11, they will use part of the frequency band overlapping OTA. This means that diplexing OTA onto the satellite cables will not work. IT DOES WORK TODAY but when DirecTV 10 and 11 start transmitting the diplexing will fail.
You can still use diplexing to get OTA to older receivers, anything that does not support Ku/Ka band (the MPEG-4 channels). Connect the four outputs from the AT-9 dish to the Zinwell WB-68 multiswitch. Take four outputs from the WB68 multiswitch and connect them to an old POWERED 5x8 multiswitch. Connect your OTA to the fifth input of the 5x8. You will now have four outputs left from the WB68, these will support Ku/Ka receivers (the R20 and HR20). The eight outputs from the old multiswitch will support older non-MPEG 4 receivers and will have OTA diplexed onto them.
It is possible that the old 5x8 multiswitch with built-in diplexing will not isolate the signals enough to eliminate interference with OTA. No-one really knows until the new satellites are up. If there is a problem you will have to insert diplexers in each of the cables between the WB68 and the old 5x8 to strip out the interfering signals.


There is also a possibility that by moving the b-band converters to the outputs of the WB68 instead of being connected to the receivers directly you will be able to diplex OTA. Again no-one can be sure until they've tried it, and that can't be done until the new satellites are on line.

It is likely that all new national HD will be in MPEG-4 and on the new satellites. No-one is sure how long there will be the current MPEG-2 HD channels, maybe for a long time.
 

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Éminence grise
Joined
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8,473 Posts
harsh said:
Can you separate the Winegard from the amplifier? If not, you could run an 18VDC (or whatever the amp is rated at) power inserter above where you split the leads to go to your various TVs/receivers and that should keep the amplifier happy.

I have a theory that national content will stay on the Ku birds due to their wider coverage. Ka beams are generally narrower and more succeptible to fade.

As for your hefty investment, that's why they've been discouraging purchased hardware for a while now.
The current Ka sats only have spot beams, but Directv 10 & 11 will have CONUS beams also.
 

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AllStar
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80 Posts
A few people have tested B-band converter at WB68 output and it works ok. Should also work with no WB68 if B-band converter is up stream of diplexer near dish. Only problem is B-band converter does not look like was made for outside use.
Claus
 

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Registered
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Claus - I don't see how anyone has actually tested putting the b-band converter at the WB68 since the new satellites have not yet been launched so there are no Ka-lo signals to convert. I haven't even seen anyone posting using test equipment to do this since it would probably be a very expensive test to set up. The only way to know will be to try it when we are getting Ka-lo signals from DirecTV 10 and 11.
 

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Registered
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manny1 said:
Thanks! Question is however, as D* adds "nationals" to their HD lineup, are they going to add them to the new KA birds or to the exsisting KU transponders. I've got a fairly big investment in current mpeg2 boxes and would REALLY dislike having to run a separate line for OTA to each.
All new national HD (2007) will be on the Ka birds.

But the good new is D* is developing a FTM (Frequency Translation Module) that will provide a single cable solution. So if you have 2 cables to your DVR, one can use FTM and one can be OTA.

Earl thinks we should know more about FTM availability before Thanksgiving.
 
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