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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
In 2009, KOMO TV 4 Seattle was getting 31 cents per household, from Tacoma's Click Cable.The amount in 2015, to a whopping 684% increase to $2.43! This with Broadcaster contracts, retainsmission fees, they doubled the fees overnight for 3 out of 5 Seattle TV stations on Jan 1st. The rates will go up to over $2 a household by 2017 for 4 out of the 5 stations. If this is the case, no wonder Dish's prices are going to go up. This is from Tacoma's TV Click.
 

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Comcast didn't charge for locals or RSNs at one time but most markets do now.

The latest move in a trend where the carriers laying their cards on the table and hoping that the customers will appreciate their candor and why the prices must go up.

The funny part is that they base rates didn't go down to reflect breaking the costs out.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
I think they are complaining about the rates they have to pay. They want the subscriber to know, it is not their fault the rates go up. There has to be a limit. OTA TV should be inexpensive to the consumer, as it is free OTA with an antenna. With all of the competition out there, I think OTA TV sees a cash cow with retransmission rates. But in reality the TV station should be the one that is happy that Dish, Direct, or cable will be willing to retransmit their signal to outlaying areas. Some put in translators into rural areas, and that costs plenty. Maybe the locals should go back into a separate package, as if you want them, you pay separate for them. That way, Dish, Direct, or cable could adjust the prices by what they have to pay. Does dish have to sell OTA locals in with the packages? I always felt that channels should be sold on their on merit. If the programmer wants too much, and dish adds their slight profit, and then the consumer can choose if they want to pay the price. That way the rest of the programmers do not get stuck with the overall price increase. But I doubt we will see that, unless people start dropping the services left and right. But we may see more of that in the future with streaming.
 

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The local stations know that DISH and DIRECTV have trouble competing with cable if they don't offer LIL so the sword cuts both ways.
 

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That is a huge increase in OTA fees. I can't see how any Sat or Cable provider could recoup that cost with the limited slots they have to include their own ads in the stream that replace some of the local and national ads that over the air viewers see.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
I figure what Dish/Direct/Cable should do is to offer the locals separate. If the subscriber wants them, then they pay the given rate. That way the channels are offered, but everyone is not stuck to pay the rates. I always felt that the Sports channels should all be in a package, or at least most. Maybe an offering of ESPN in a basic package, but the rest in Sport's packages. As they add a lot to our bills. Where is the limit? In 10 or 20 years are we going to be paying double what we pay now? I agree. I cannot see any provider keeping up with these horrible rate increases. Right now all locals are included. The inclusion is the same if the market offers 5 channels or 35 channels. Dish must have to put out a lot more money in a market like LA or NY. Dish offers 9 channels out of Portland and 15 out of Seattle. That is not bad compared to huge markets. As much as we want the sub channels, even if we could get them added, any idea what Dish may be paying then?
 

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mwdxer said:
Yes, I know that the subscriber wants their locals in most cases,. but some get them for free OTA.
Seattle is a very problematic market for OTA reception.
 

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mwdxer said:
I figure what Dish/Direct/Cable should do is to offer the locals separate. If the subscriber wants them, then they pay the given rate.
The local channels would not agree to such a configuration. They want all the eyeballs, not just those who are willing to subscribe. Since they can make that one of the conditions of carriage, they do. It is just like bundling and most of the other "inflexibilities" that we must suffer.
 

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Dish used to have locals as an optional purchase... but that was before they had all the markets covered. I think right about the time that happened is when they started bundling it in the basic package. The way people go nuts when a LiL is dropped during a dispute, I can't imagine too many people not wanting their LiLs.

Also... when Dish did allow the LiLs to be dropped, you didn't get OTA data for your OTA antenna channels... so people were subscribing to LiLs to get that info anyway.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
So now the OTA TV stations even call the shots the way Dish sells them? As much as I like OTA TV, it seems between the cable services and OTA, it is really a dictatorship. Something has to break in time as the pricing cannot keep going up. I see it now that Dish, Direct, and Cable are losing more subs each month. Out here on the Oregon Coast, several Portland stations will be adding more sub channels. We should be getting METV, Get TV, Escape, Laff, Decades, and Cozi OTA come this Summer. More and more roof top antennas are showing up. Right now we have 10 OTA, 9 digital and one analog, but we may have 16 or 17 by the end of Summer and those services are free.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
At the time when KATU ABC (Fisher) was dropped by Dish, the 211k receiver was not out then and no OTA tuners came with Dish receivers. Add to that KATU analog then, so no guide was available anyway. OTA TV we get the OTA guide for most here, but not all.
 

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Optional LIL wasn't around very long after DISH started offering OTA tuners. The 921 had one but it could not be recorded as it was analog only.

Expecting that DISH will provide full and accurate guide information for channels that they will likely never carry is not reasonable. That's why you have to pay for guide data for most other OTA recording solutions.
 

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I expect DISH to be mt total entertainment solution. If a channel appears on my receiver I expect to have accurate EPG. I understand the limitations. Thousands of subchannels nationwide take up space in a table that is already large. But I would like DISH to find a way to do better. Even if it means a separate EPG that is either internet delivered or not updated as often as the delivered via satellite channels.

If I have to go somewhere else to get what I want (guide information or programming) that pushes me away from DISH. I do not consider it unreasonable to ask DISH to provide EPG for channels their receivers will tune.
 

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James Long said:
I do not consider it unreasonable to ask DISH to provide EPG for channels their receivers will tune.
Not unreasonable, but perhaps impractical.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
If you want an OTA channel's schedule, ask Dish. You may get it. They updated our PBS mux here. The main channel was correct but the second one wasn't. It was not Dish's fault as out PBS dropped the 4rd channel and went to only three. The guide got messed up showing the wrong channel that was deleted. But Dish was very nice in getting that issue solved.
 

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mwdxer said:
If you want an OTA channel's schedule, ask Dish. You may get it. They updated our PBS mux here. The main channel was correct but the second one wasn't. It was not Dish's fault as out PBS dropped the 4rd channel and went to only three. The guide got messed up showing the wrong channel that was deleted. But Dish was very nice in getting that issue solved.
Since last year I have tried several times to get Dish to fix the reversed local network affiliations in the EPG. Even the local tech that came out was unaware of the error in the EPG until I showed him. I can't imagine getting Dish to add EPG data for two missing sub-channels.

Since calling Dish does not work, what is your secret to get them to fix EPG issues? :)
 
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