[harsh]

Because Amazon already has a key piece of the NFL, they'd get less incremental value from buying NFLST than would Apple, who has zero NFL content yet.

Looking at it from Amazon's viewpoint, I'd imagine that the attraction to OOM Sunday games is at least as big of a draw as a Thursday exclusive.

 

[NashGuy]

I doubt that whomever gets NFL ST will be able to resell it via other systems, with the possible exception of distribution to businesses (eg: ESPN+ for business sold via DIRECTV). I don't believe the NFL wants to take the risk on selling NFLST via every platform (they want billions whether or not the end service is viable). Having a partner who could resell would take the risk off of the NFL.

If you're responding to my immediately preceding post, I wasn't talking about a winning bidder then redistributing the service via third parties. I was talking about the possibility of the NFL themselves selling it both DTC themselves (similar to MLB.tv) and also selling it non-exclusively through multiple resellers (similar to MLB Extra Innings).

So yes, I agree with what you're saying. The most likely scenario is that the NFL finds a "greater fool," i.e. a deep-pocketed business who will buy exclusive rights to NFLST for more than the service could ever bring in as a standalone business operated like the MLB and NBA run their out-of-market packages. But who's the greater fool, Apple or Amazon?

 

[NashGuy]

Looking at it from Amazon's viewpoint, I'd imagine that the attraction to OOM Sunday games is at least as big of a draw as a Thursday exclusive.

I don't know about that. But either way, Amazon is already spending $1 billion per year over the next several years for TNF. So how much more does being the exclusive seller of NFLST do for Prime? Seems like diminishing returns to me.

 

[harsh]

Seems like diminishing returns to me.

What seems like diminishing returns to you may well look like cornering the available market to Amazon.

 

[harsh]

I was talking about the possibility of the NFL themselves selling it both DTC themselves (similar to MLB.tv) and also selling it non-exclusively through multiple resellers (similar to MLB Extra Innings).

This would be a 180 degree shift from what they've done in the past and are suggesting that they're going to do going forward. The NFL is looking for a subcontractors to handle everything, not bring bits and pieces of it in-house. Network TV handles the LIL and the winner will handle the OOM Sunday games. The NFL just waits patiently for their wire transfers.

 

[NashGuy]

This would be a 180 degree shift from what they've done in the past and are suggesting that they're going to do going forward. The NFL is looking for a subcontractors to handle everything, not bring bits and pieces of it in-house. Network TV handles the LIL and the winner will handle the OOM Sunday games. The NFL just waits patiently for their wire transfers.

Ah, OK, now tell me about the NFL's planned NFL+ service which they're saying they'll launch next month as their own direct-to-consumer streaming service.

That said, yes, the NFL has always preferred to sell NFLST to an exclusive third party (DirecTV) as long as they're willing to pay them a crazy high amount for it which the NFL figures is more than they could get by selling it any other way. And so, yes, they'll do that again with Apple or Amazon if either of them will go for it. And I suspect Apple will. But if no one will, then the NFL will do it themselves, as the MLB and NBA do with their OOM packages. And as the NFL appears set to do with their odds-and-ends NFL+ package.

 

[wmb]

Ah, OK, now tell me about the NFL's planned NFL+ service which they're saying they'll launch next month as their own direct-to-consumer streaming service.

The timing for this service is interesting in light of their desire for streaming for Sunday Ticket. Why wouldn’t the use the Sunday Ticket streamer be their tech partner for NFL+.

I could see the NFL wanting control over the content on NFL+, but by starting the tech side before announcing Sunday Ticket winner locks the technology in, and you run compatibility risks between the two platforms.

I’d expect Sunday Ticket subscribers to be a subset of NFL+ subscribers.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[harsh]

Ah, OK, now tell me about the NFL's planned NFL+ service which they're saying they'll launch next month as their own direct-to-consumer streaming service.

I'd guess this package is going to be stillborn. There's already too much analysis available through other media.

 

[James Long]

Wow. Condemned before any details are given. Barely even mentioned the name!

 

[NashGuy]

The timing for this service is interesting in light of their desire for streaming for Sunday Ticket. Why wouldn’t the use the Sunday Ticket streamer be their tech partner for NFL+.

I could see the NFL wanting control over the content on NFL+, but by starting the tech side before announcing Sunday Ticket winner locks the technology in, and you run compatibility risks between the two platforms.

I’d expect Sunday Ticket subscribers to be a subset of NFL+ subscribers.

I think what's going on is this:

The NFL wants Apple to up their bid for NFLST even further (MOAR $$$!) and, if it's high enough, the NFL is saying that they'll throw in that stake in NFL Media that they're reportedly trying to tie to the NFLST deal. And the NFL Media content slated to go in this proposed $5/mo NFL+ service would instead go to Apple too.

To increase negotiating pressure on Apple, and to be prepared in case Apple doesn't offer them enough, the NFL has prepared this NFL+ service for a supposed August launch and leaked a few details about it to the press. But I think they're hoping that they won't need to launch it, because Apple will give them so much money that they'll get that content too, in addition to NFLST. If that happens, I tend to think Apple won't launch some kind of little $5/mo NFL add-on but will rather include some or all of that content in their main Apple TV+ service and/or with NFLST. Perhaps they'll offer free live mobile streaming of local Sunday NFL games exclusively on iPhone.

 

[glrush]

PFT references a New York Times article (behind a paywall) but it could simply be the NFL trying to drive up their price for NFST

Report: Google has made a bid for Sunday Ticket - ProFootballTalk (nbcsports.com)

 

[NashGuy]

Wow, a lot going on right now. It increasingly looks to me like the NFLST negotiations aren't going quite like the NFL had hoped. Because, first off, the NFL has in fact launched their own NFL+ service featuring content that might have gone to the NFLST winning bidder if they'd bid high enough to include a stake in NFL Media.

NFL Expands Media Footprint, Launches League-Branded Streaming Service

The NFL has launched a league-branded subscription streaming outlet featuring live mobile rights once controlled by Verizon. NFL+, as the new service is known, is available in two versions. The bas…

deadline.com

Here's a link to the NFL+ service's new splash page:

https://www.nfl.com/plus/learn-more?icampaign=npl-edi-ctp-NFL+_NFL_Centerpiece_Launch_Promo

And then on top of that, we have news that Google has supposedly entered the NFLST bidding war as another deep-pocketed tech company who might give the NFL the big bucks they want. Which suggests that neither Apple or Amazon are willing to pay what the NFL is hoping for.

I'm beginning to think that the author of this little piece from last week may have a point:

Are NFL's Sunday Ticket talks not going well? - ProFootballTalk

As we wait for the NFL to decide on a new partner for Sunday Ticket, the folks at Sports Business Journal have floated an intriguing possibility.Are the talks not going well?John Ourand suggested it, and Ben Fischer mentioned it at the top of his most recent SBJ Football newsletter.“They...

profootballtalk.nbcsports.com

 

[B. Shoe]

Here's a link to the NFL+ service's new splash page:

https://www.nfl.com/plus/learn-more?icampaign=npl-edi-ctp-NFL+_NFL_Centerpiece_Launch_Promo

As a standalone product, and a self-proclaimed NFL preseason nerd, I like this. Before the NFL GamePass days, there was a product called NFL Preseason Live, which cost $25 for the four week preseason. It allowed access to out of market preseason games (and this was before nearly half of the preseason games were live on broadcast, as they are now.)

It's $5/month, and I can cancel out when I want. For the bloggers out there that thrive on the coaches film for their hot takes, $80/season for the "premium" version isn't much. As you mentioned, it might be throwing a wrench in the NFLST negotiation gears, but strictly looking at the NFL+ product offered, I like it.

 

[harsh]

Which suggests that neither Apple or Amazon are willing to pay what the NFL is hoping for.

Alternatively, it suggests that Google wasn't interested in participating in all of the nonsense discussions thus far. This may be similar to eBay "sniping".

 

[B. Shoe]

PFT references a New York Times article (behind a paywall) but it could simply be the NFL trying to drive up their price for NFST

Report: Google has made a bid for Sunday Ticket - ProFootballTalk (nbcsports.com)

Added thoughts on this, as I'll make assumptions that Google running Sunday Ticket would operate it through their YouTube TV platform: There have been other threads/discussions about having to subscribe to DIRECTV to be able to subscribe to Sunday Ticket, and the roundabout cost of the D* monthly fees. Even as a YTTV subscriber, I'd rather it end up in a platform like Apple TV+, or ESPN+, where although a subscription to the service would be required, the monthly fees are much less than in comparison to a full-fledged provider service like YTTV or D*.

 

[harsh]

Even as a YTTV subscriber, I'd rather it end up in a platform like Apple TV+, or ESPN+, where although a subscription to the service would be required, the monthly fees are much less than in comparison to a full-fledged provider service like YTTV or D*.

I'm not convinced that a conventional subscription to a (v)MPVD will be required anymore. DIRECTV pretty effectively proved that isn't viable anymore. You may get a bundling break but I'm betting that NFLST will be available as a standalone product with its own apps.

 

[b4pjoe]

Added thoughts on this, as I'll make assumptions that Google running Sunday Ticket would operate it through their YouTube TV platform

According to two different articles it is Youtube it would be through. Not Youtube TV.

 

[JoeTheDragon]

Added thoughts on this, as I'll make assumptions that Google running Sunday Ticket would operate it through their YouTube TV platform: There have been other threads/discussions about having to subscribe to DIRECTV to be able to subscribe to Sunday Ticket, and the roundabout cost of the D* monthly fees. Even as a YTTV subscriber, I'd rather it end up in a platform like Apple TV+, or ESPN+, where although a subscription to the service would be required, the monthly fees are much less than in comparison to a full-fledged provider service like YTTV or D*.

then YTTV will need to add back the missing local RSN's and other sports channels. Kind of looks bad to force sports fans into an big TV package that does not even have your local RSN's

 

[harsh]

then YTTV will need to add back the missing local RSN's and other sports channels.

Not that it matters, but YTTV wouldn't have to add back anything. They're more than capable of streaming the games without having access to the broadcast/satcast channels. Their offering isn't limited to what they "uplink" as it is with DIRECTV.

 

[B. Shoe]

According to two different articles it is Youtube it would be through. Not Youtube TV.

And this goes to show what happens when you make assumptions.