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Godfather
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353 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Folks,
This is just another rant post. Sometimes I need to vent.
Recently I have been battling some issues on my system. I've now got case management involved and they are trying to help me out.

While on a call recently, I was offered an HR34 for $199. I told them that I'd sleep on it. (As I have a LOT of receivers)
So I call back and decide to take them up on it. I prepare by hooking up an SWM8 that I had in storage (so now I have 3 switches) and I am dedicating it directly to the HR34.

The person I eventually got to said that they can still honor that $199 price. So then she says they'll add another $49 for install. At $199 I was borderline on this receiver. At $249, forget it. So I told her that I wasn't interested in paying $50 for someone to walk in, plug in the receiver and leave. She told me to wait a minute. She comes back from hold and says that because I've been a good customer for over 13 years, they can waive that install fee.

She was having "trouble with her system" and couldn't place the order. She told me she would place it and call me back within 3 days. I asked her to make notes on the account about the pricing and she said she would absolutely do that.

3 days go by and I hear nothing. I call back today to get a status. I keep getting the run around. First person says, I don't qualify for the $199 price and they can't waive the $49 fee. Huh??? That CSR tells me to call case management. I call them and they tell me the same thing. What the heck? They transfer me over to "verifications". They tell me the same thing.

Here is the kicker.....they offered me that deal. I didn't approach them. Now I did talk them out of the install fee, but the $199 offer was them asking me if I'd be interested. Eventually after 90 minutes on the phone, they come back with:
$399 + $49 install and we will give you $10 off per month for the next 24 months. I begrudgingly agree.

So they go to place the order and they can't put it in. #$%@#$%$%#@%%
The person on the phone is speculating that it is because I am not using DECA and I am ethernet only for whole home. I am using ethernet rather than DECA because I use OTA. Can't have both DECA and OTA. OTA wins as that is more important to me. "Unsupported" ethernet whole home works fine. At this point who cares. Let's just say that this will be standalone receiver and lets order it. Still no go. She keeps trying and trying to put the order in and finally while on hold for the umpteenth time, I get disconnected.

They do make it so difficult for me to like them.

I've been a very loyal customer. I have a very high bill, and for the most part I am a self maintainer with the protection plan.

I was also a little perturbed to find out that I only have 1 owned HDDVR on my account. I am supposed to have 3. Years ago, (April 2003) I bought 3 HR10-250s. (at $1000 a pop). Well, eventually their drives died and with the protection plan, I got replacements. I've lost track of which receiver replaced which, but the replacements for the HR10-250 were to be owned HR20s.

These are just a few examples.

OK...I'm done my rant. For now. So I am dreading calling back in after I was disconnected.


UPDATE: So DTV calls me back. Whew. She tells me that she has to order a connection kit for $49 and a client for $49. What???? They said they need 1 client for every HR34 ordered. So that $399 is really $499. I told her that I have 10 clients (in the form of 10 HDDVRs). Oh well, she said she can waive that fee.
 

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The Shadow Knows!
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37,060 Posts
Wow.

All I can say is sorry about that. I know the CSRs are still working through training issues. I know they are supposed to confirm that every HR34 has internet access. Most of them take that to mean they must add a CCK. The techs are instructed to install HR34 as coax networking only, not cat5. You don't have to have a separate client for the HR34, in fact there are no such clients.

You and I know that cat5 can work very well if there's an expert in the home with the right knowledge and equipment. But, for many people it doesn't work and DIRECTV doesn't want the support headaches. So if there's a tech involved, it will be a coax-networked install 100% of the time.
 

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Godfather
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353 Posts
Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Stuart,
I hear you. I was sitting here fat dumb and happy with ethernet whole home until I was over a friends house with DECA. His whole home experience was more responsive than mine. I may try to get a seperate router and try to isolate all of my DirecTV equipment to a different vlan. I'd love to have DECA, but because I live between 2 large cities (Baltimore and Washington) and I am only allowed locals from the city that I don't want (Baltimore) I need OTA to pull in the locals from Washington.
 

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DaBears
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6,085 Posts
The requirements for ordering a HR34 have been out for quite awhile. HR34s with their internal DECA's do not get shut off when an ethernet cable is plugged in. This means it would interfere with your OTA anyways unless you installed a BS Filter on the receiver.

Essentially it's going to be either choose a different method of OTA deliver, or remove it, and get an HR34 with supported WHDVR setup or go with another HD DVR and call it good.
 

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Godfather
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353 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Shades228,
Thanks for the comment. I was unaware of the HR34 inteferring with my OTA. I was going to go with a suggestion VOS had made which was to use a diplexer and terminate the OTA port.
I do intend to connect an AM21 to this receiver as well. With OTA at that receiver I happen to have 3 coax runs going to it. So I can keep the OTA on separate coax.

Thanks.
 

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DaBears
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6,085 Posts
BS Filters block the frequency range of the WHDVR signals. They're used for SD receivers that cannot have a DECA connected to it. Without it you would get errors on your other receivers. DECA is the way of the future with DIRECTV and while I can understand your frustration at some point you're going to need to separate your system. If you have extra lines in the rooms it's not hard to separate your OTA out and then run lines to the other rooms if needed. Yes this will add an initial up front cost but once you get on a supported setup your frustrations with future orders will go away.
 

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Save the Clock Tower!!
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2,446 Posts
dinotheo said:
I am using ethernet rather than DECA because I use OTA. Can't have both DECA and OTA.
The HR34 requires SWiM, which is single wire multiswitch. Do you have two coaxes running to each DVR? If so, when switching to SWiM you would be able to dedicate one wire for OTA (no diplexing) and the other for SWiM/DECA.
 

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DaBears
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6,085 Posts
David Ortiz said:
The HR34 requires SWiM, which is single wire multiswitch. Do you have two coaxes running to each DVR? If so, when switching to SWiM you would be able to dedicate one wire for OTA (no diplexing) and the other for SWiM/DECA.
He has a SWM 16 in his signature, with a 6x8 which would need to be replaced as well.
 

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dinotheo said:
I may try to get a seperate router and try to isolate all of my DirecTV equipment to a different vlan.
That is pretty much what DECA does. It isolates your receiver traffic, except Internet requests, to the DECA Cloud. Normal receiver traffic, playlist updates, MRV, etc, do not touch your home network.
 

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Godfather
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353 Posts
Discussion Starter · #10 ·
David Ortiz said:
The HR34 requires SWiM, which is single wire multiswitch. Do you have two coaxes running to each DVR? If so, when switching to SWiM you would be able to dedicate one wire for OTA (no diplexing) and the other for SWiM/DECA.
I have setup a SWM8 cascaded off of the WB616 that will be dedicated to the HR34.
 

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Godfather
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353 Posts
Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Shades228 said:
BS Filters block the frequency range of the WHDVR signals. They're used for SD receivers that cannot have a DECA connected to it. Without it you would get errors on your other receivers. DECA is the way of the future with DIRECTV and while I can understand your frustration at some point you're going to need to separate your system. If you have extra lines in the rooms it's not hard to separate your OTA out and then run lines to the other rooms if needed. Yes this will add an initial up front cost but once you get on a supported setup your frustrations with future orders will go away.
Unfortunately, I don't have dual coax runs everywhere. Most locations do. My bedrooms, kitchen and bar don't. And at least in the master bedroom I want OTA. I do have 6 coax runs to my 5 bedrooms. So I might be able to eventually use that 6th coax as dedicated OTA to the bedrooms. All of my bedroom coax runs go up into the attic and then down into the wall. But that will be a project for another day.
 

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Hall Of Fame
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3,588 Posts
Since you have Whole Home DVR can't you just record whatever you need to see on the OTA channel in one of the other rooms and then watch it in the bedrooms where OTA isn't available?

I only have OTA in 2 rooms at my house, but I have AM21s hooked up in both of those rooms. So if I need to watch something off OTA in my bedroom I just record it in the living room and watch it in the bedroom slightly behind live.
 

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Godfather
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353 Posts
Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Regular TV shows aren't the issue. I can record those from any other receiver and watch them. It is live sports....(football) and local news.
 

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Beware the Attack Basset
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24,428 Posts
RunnerFL said:
Normal receiver traffic, playlist updates, MRV, etc, do not touch your home network.
That's more likely a function of your router (or switch) than it is a feature of DECA.

To my knowledge, MoCA doesn't include a TCP/IP routing table so it doesn't know whether the destination device is inside the cloud or out. Each adapter has a device ID (one of 16 and not to be confused with an IP or MAC address) but there's certainly no practical limit on how many IP/MAC addresses that a single adapter may be bridging for.

A single CCK (or a conventional white adapter used in its place) must be able to represent the route to entirely of the Internet.
 

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harsh said:
That's more likely a function of your router (or switch) than it is a feature of DECA.
Wrong... Again you speak of things you know nothing about since you're not even a DirecTV customer.

Using DECA takes all the traffic between receivers off of your network and puts it into the "DECA Cloud".
 

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Beware the Attack Basset
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RunnerFL said:
Using DECA takes all the traffic between receivers off of your network and puts it into the "DECA Cloud".
Have you looked at the traffic that passes across the CCK (or any DECA adapter) Ethernet port to confirm that no DECA traffic leaks out of the cloud?

IOW, do you know this because you've tested it or simply because subscribing to DIRECTV endows you with such insight?

You could use an Ethernet hub to confirm or deny the presence of DECA traffic outside the cloud. If traffic escapes, the hub will flash whenever traffic escapes.
 

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harsh said:
Have you looked at the traffic that passes across the CCK (or any DECA adapter) Ethernet port to confirm that no DECA traffic leaks out of the cloud?

IOW, do you know this because you've tested it or simply because subscribing to DIRECTV endows you with such insight?

You could use an Ethernet hub to confirm or deny the presence of DECA traffic outside the cloud. If traffic escapes, the hub will flash whenever traffic escapes.
I've tested it. I know how networking works, but you don't have to have a degree to know that the DECA traffic, except Internet requests, doesn't leave the cloud. You don't have to have the DECA network hooked up to your router for all the units to see each other. Pretty easy confirmation huh?
 

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Beware the Attack Basset
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RunnerFL said:
I've tested it.
How did you test it?
You don't have to have the DECA network hooked up to your router for all the units to see each other. Pretty easy confirmation huh?
It is easy because it doesn't prove that DECA cloud traffic never leaves the cloud.

Proving that DECA traffic exists within the cloud is not proof that it doesn't exist outside the cloud. The popular claim is that it doesn't and I'm asking for proof that DECA traffic doesn't make its way outside the cloud.
 

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harsh said:
How did you test it?
Wireshark and simple deductive reasoning.

harsh said:
It is easy because it doesn't prove that DECA cloud traffic never leaves the cloud.
Yes, it actually does. If the DECA traffic had to leave the cloud for MRV to work then MRV wouldn't work unless the DECA network was connected to your home network. It's that simple.

harsh said:
Proving that DECA traffic exists within the cloud is not proof that it doesn't exist outside the cloud. The popular claim is that it doesn't and I'm asking for proof that DECA traffic doesn't make its way outside the cloud.
And I'm telling you... The only traffic from the DECA Cloud to your network is Internet requests.
 

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Godfather
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413 Posts
dinotheo said:
Stuart,
I hear you. I was sitting here fat dumb and happy with ethernet whole home until I was over a friends house with DECA. His whole home experience was more responsive than mine. I may try to get a seperate router and try to isolate all of my DirecTV equipment to a different vlan. I'd love to have DECA, but because I live between 2 large cities (Baltimore and Washington) and I am only allowed locals from the city that I don't want (Baltimore) I need OTA to pull in the locals from Washington.
I have the exact opposite experience I tried my H24 and H24 with just the internal DECA the other day and it was super slow. I plunged them back in my unmanaged switch and its fast as ever again now with my other receivers that don't have internal DECAs
 
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