[Macfan]

I have an HR23-700 and several times now I have had shows marked "keep until I delete" and had them disappear from the list. These are not PPV shows, they are from DIY, Comedy Central, etc.

I don't know if it's deleting it because it needs space. There are plenty of other shows that it could delete (the stupid movie reviews it records automatically for instance!) If somehow, it got to the point where I had filled the drive with shows I didn't want deleted, I would expect it to cease recording shows. It should never delete a show I have marked as "Do not delete," what's the deal?

Michael

 

[The Merg]

There's a disconnect between the KUID setting and the Keep X Number of Episodes setting. Are you telling it to keep episodes that are part of a SL. If so, it appears that the Keep X Number of Episodes setting overrides the KUID setting. It is something that has been brought up before, but does not seem to have be rectified and as far as we can tell, it is expected behavior according to the programmers.

One way around it is to set your SL to keep all episodes. That way it will never bump that older episode. You would then still mark the episode as KUID for the case when your DVR fills up and it needs to delete shows to make room.

- Merg

 

[Drew2k]

As Merg was saying, the only reason a show marked Keep Until I Delete (KUID) would be deleted is if there was a setting on the Series Link for Keep At Most (KAM) and it was NOT set to ALL SHOWS.

The KAM setting overrides the KUID setting in this sense: It keeps the most recent N shows.

If you have a Series Link set to KUID and KAM 2 shows, your playlist will never delete that series to make room for a recording of some other series, BUT it will delete your oldest program of that series to record the newest showing. EX: Brand new SL for a daily series set to KUID KAM=2. It records Monday and records Tuesday. The next day it will delete the Monday episode and record the Wednesday episode.

 

[lflorack]

I think that the logical assumption is that KUID should override all other settings. If needed, a KUID flag should reduce the number of KAM number setting for that show by one. The way it currently works (according to the above discussion) is at the very least counter-intuitive and it should be changed. Just my opinion of course but with the way it is, how is one supposed to keep a particular show while keeping a rolling number of shows too? Keeping them ALL is really not the answer (again IMHO).

 

[Steve]

OTOH, if you manually "keep" a PLAYLIST show by tagging it with the BLUE button, it will never be deleted and can be in addition to the KAM # of episodes. This is arguably expected behavior when using the BLUE button (at least for me).

Since the BLUE button flag can mean one thing in one context (SL KUID) and something else in another context (BLUE button KEEP), I suggest that the same icon not be used for both situations. Just my .02.

(This discussion is also partially responsible for this long-standing Wish List request:
SERIES LINK setup options: RECORD: [First Run/Repeat/Both/All with Duplicates]; RECORD THIS TIME SLOT ONLY?: [Y/N]; RECORD THIS WEEK-DAY ONLY?: [Y/N]; KEEP AT MOST: [1/2/3/4/5/10/ALL]; WHEN LIMIT REACHED: [Delete Oldest/Stop Recording]; AUTODELETE WHEN DISK FULL?: [Y/N] )

 

[Drew2k]

When I moved from TiVo to the DVR Plus line the KAM override of KUID threw me, but after using it and studying it, it now makes more sense to me than ever.

If you consider someone who wants to record the daily news, would you rather have the two oldest shows, or the two newest shows? You'd want the more recent... So this is how I have my SL for NBC Nightly News and ABC World News - both are KUID, KAM=2. When I come home I always have the two latest recordings of each.

I really can't think of an example where someone would want to keep the oldest two episodes, but if this is an issue (and it hasn't been much of one since the DVR was introduced) DIRECTV could add one more setting to the recording options when KAM is not set to ALL: [Most Recent] [Oldest]. This way the user can control which they want to keep. If it's oldest and KUID is set, once the KAM limit is reached there would be no more recordings ever until the user deleted one. If it's Most Recent, the recordings would be cycled once the KAM limit was reached.

 

[Steve]

I really can't think of an example where someone would want to keep the oldest two episodes, but if this is an issue (and it hasn't been much of one since the DVR was introduced) DIRECTV could add one more setting to the recording options when KAM is not set to ALL: [Most Recent] [Oldest].

Is that subtlety different than the current Wish List request (When Limit Reached: Delete Oldest/Stop Recording)? If so, how could we modify the request?

 

[raott]

When I moved from TiVo to the DVR Plus line the KAM override of KUID threw me, but after using it and studying it, it now makes more sense to me than ever.

If you consider someone who wants to record the daily news, would you rather have the two oldest shows, or the two newest shows? You'd want the more recent... So this is how I have my SL for NBC Nightly News and ABC World News - both are KUID, KAM=2. When I come home I always have the two latest recordings of each.

I really can't think of an example where someone would want to keep the oldest two episodes, but if this is an issue (and it hasn't been much of one since the DVR was introduced) DIRECTV could add one more setting to the recording options when KAM is not set to ALL: [Most Recent] [Oldest]. This way the user can control which they want to keep. If it's oldest and KUID is set, once the KAM limit is reached there would be no more recordings ever until the user deleted one. If it's Most Recent, the recordings would be cycled once the KAM limit was reached.

In your scenario all you have to do is set the KAM = 2 and not set KUID and then you continue to get the two newest episodes. Why would you set the KUID?

The problem with the way KUID is set up now (other than intuitively KUID should mean "I") is when you set a series to KUID and KAM 2 and then have a day long marathon of shows - which happens often with pre-teen shows, you end up with the DVR recording show after show, all day, instead of recording two and stopping.

 

[lflorack]

OTOH, if you manually "keep" a PLAYLIST show by tagging it with the BLUE button, it will never be deleted and can be in addition to the KAM # of episodes. This is arguably expected behavior when using the BLUE button (at least for me).

Since the BLUE button flag can mean one thing in one context (SL KUID) and something else in another context (BLUE button KEEP), I suggest that the same icon not be used for both situations. Just my .02.

Hmmmm. I guess I was (am?) getting confused with KUID and the "Keep" via the blue button. I agree it's confusing and that the icon for the different contexts is the same. The Blue Button 'Keep' is what I would expect.

 

[lflorack]

When I moved from TiVo to the DVR Plus line the KAM override of KUID threw me, but after using it and studying it, it now makes more sense to me than ever.

If you consider someone who wants to record the daily news, would you rather have the two oldest shows, or the two newest shows? You'd want the more recent... So this is how I have my SL for NBC Nightly News and ABC World News - both are KUID, KAM=2. When I come home I always have the two latest recordings of each.

I guess I don't understand the need for KUID in your example. If you set KAM to 2, you'll already have the most recent two shows. I do a similar thing with the news as you do except that I only keep one and I don't use KUID. It works fine.

 

[Steve]

I guess I don't understand the need for KUID in your example. If you set KAM to 2, you'll already have the most recent two shows. I do a similar thing with the news as you do except that I only keep one and I don't use KUID. It works fine.

I think the distinction is do you want to see the 2 most recent episodes that were aired in your PLAYLIST, or the 2 oldest?

Hence the Wish List request, when the PLAYLIST limit of 2 is reached, should the HR2x "stop recording" newer episodes (and just keep what's already there), or "delete the oldest" to make room for newer episodes, but keep no more than 2 at any time.

 

[raott]

I think the distinction is do you want to see the 2 most recent episodes that were aired in your PLAYLIST, or the 2 oldest?

Hence the Wish List request, when the PLAYLIST limit of 2 is reached, should the HR2x "stop recording" newer episodes (and just keep what's already there), or "delete the oldest" to make room for newer episodes, but keep no more than 2 at any time.

But again, to see the 2 most recent episodes, all you have to do is set KAM =2. You don't have to turn on KUID.

I agree though, there should be the option.

 

[lflorack]

I think the distinction is do you want to see the 2 most recent episodes that were aired in your PLAYLIST, or the 2 oldest?

Hence the Wish List request, when the PLAYLIST limit of 2 is reached, should the HR2x "stop recording" newer episodes (and just keep what's already there), or "delete the oldest" to make room for newer episodes, but keep no more than 2 at any time.

In this case, I'd want the most recent two. So now I'm trying to think of a case that I'd want set it to keep the oldest two -- while skipping the more recent shows, and I'm having trouble doing it. In either case, shows would be skipped if I exceed the KAM setting and I think I'd want the more recent shows.

When I was talking about the 'Keep' setting, I was thinking of the blue button results where marking a show 'Keep', it stays until I delete it (at least I think it does).

 

[DogLover]

I guess I don't understand the need for KUID in your example. If you set KAM to 2, you'll already have the most recent two shows. I do a similar thing with the news as you do except that I only keep one and I don't use KUID. It works fine.

If you do not set the KUID, then those episodes can be deleted when the DVR runs low on space or if you reach the KAM limit. If you do set KUID, then they will only be deleted if you reach the KAM limit, not if the DVR runs low on space.

I have to agree that having the DVR work this way is the less flexible way that they could have set this up. (Though neither way would satisfy everyone.) I wholeheartedly recommend casting your vote on the wishlist.

 

[raott]

In this case, I'd want the most recent two. So now I'm trying to think of a case that I'd want set it to keep the oldest two -- while skipping the more recent shows, and I'm having trouble doing it.

The scenario that comes into play most often (at least at my house with a 5 year old) is if there is kids show that has an all day marathon. This happens all the time on the weekends. If KUID was set and KAM set to 2, it should record two episodes and stop. Instead, it records show, after show, after show, all day tying up one tuner for the day, none of them have been watched they just keep getting recorded over each other.

 

[lflorack]

If you do not set the KUID, then those episodes can be deleted when the DVR runs low on space or if you reach the KAM limit. If you do set KUID, then they will only be deleted if you reach the KAM limit, not if the DVR runs low on space.

I have to agree that having the DVR work this way is the less flexible way that they could have set this up. (Though neither way would satisfy everyone.) I wholeheartedly recommend casting your vote on the wishlist.

OK. I've not seriously considered losing shows due to disk space because I normally don't get closer than about 80% (normally it's less) full on my two HR-20's. The way most of my recordings are set up is KAM some number and newer shows always over-write the older ones. So my disk usage never really goes up -- except for those shows I've set to 'Keep All'.

I guess we all use our DVR's a bit different. Interesting.

 

[Steve]

When I was talking about the 'Keep' setting, I was thinking of the blue button results where marking a show 'Keep', it stays until I delete it (at least I think it does).

That's definitely the expected behavior, IMHO.

If you do set KUID, then they will only be deleted if you reach the KAM limit, not if the DVR runs low on space.

So as currently implemented, you could say that KUID as a SL setting should really be relabeled as "keep until KAM limit reached", where as BLUE button KEEP means never delete, under any circumstances. In the first instance, maybe those shows shouldn't be flagged with the same BLUE circle in the PLAYLIST. Maybe a "half circle"?

 

[lflorack]

The scenario that comes into play most often (at least at my house with a 5 year old) is if there is kids show that has an all day marathon. This happens all the time on the weekends. If KUID was set and KAM set to 2, it would record two episodes and stop. Instead, it records show, after show, after show, all day tying up one tuner for the day, none of them have been watched they just keep getting recorded over each other.

I guess I have had similar 'marathon issues' in the past too. However, I've handled it by allowing them to record them all (lopping off the older ones as it went) if it wasn't over-ridden by a higher priority. Shows that are prone to running marathons I normally set at lower priorities because they are normally repeats anyway and they'll come back 'around' again soon.

However, I do see how this could be an issue in some situations. Flexibility is always a plus because as I said in the previous post, I guess we all use our DVR's a bit different.

 

[lflorack]

So as currently implemented, you could say that KUID as a SL setting should really be relabeled as "keep until KAM limit reached", where as BLUE button KEEP means never delete, under any circumstances. In the first instance, maybe those shows shouldn't be flagged with the BLUE circle in the PLAYLIST.

Makes sense to me.

 

[RunnerFL]

There are plenty of other shows that it could delete (the stupid movie reviews it records automatically for instance!)

The movies and previews aren't recorded in your area of the hard drive. They are recorded in space reserved for DirecTV. Deleting those would not free up recording space for you.